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View Full Version : Matthew Saad Muhammad vs. Roy Jones Jr.



Newpoppop
09-02-2005, 09:12 AM
I think Muhammad's amazing recuperative powers and heavy hands overcome Jones' dominance in the early rounds. Saad Muhammad by late TKO.

Roberto Aqui
09-02-2005, 12:50 PM
The oldtimers are going to favor Saad, but Jones at this weight was close to unhittable and likely the fastest LH ever. I'd favor a fairly lopsided UD. It's a bad style match up for Saad who needed a brawl to bring his chin and power into play. Roy never played that game. Obviously if Saad ever traps Roy on the ropes the game could be over, but Roy was very focused so I don't see that happening.

Newpoppop
09-02-2005, 01:06 PM
With all due respect, I beg to differ. Yaqui Lopez boxed Saad's ears off for most of 2 different fights. In the end, Saad's constant pressure and stamina enabled him to KO Lopez.

robertk
09-02-2005, 05:53 PM
Jones.

Too quick and too smart and he'll just go for a decision win==he won't fight dumb. He can shoeshine flurry his way to a decision and saad needs guys that'll trade. And since everyone lands on saad, the ball is completely in his corner to find a way to penetrate the jones defense. I don't think he has the footwork to corner him or the hand placement to avoid getting hit.

gregbeyer
09-02-2005, 07:05 PM
hey roberto...put me down as an oldtimer for jones....you *&^_%#@! lol
greg

wildhawke11
09-02-2005, 11:04 PM
Another old timer says Jones to take it

StingerKarl
09-03-2005, 08:05 PM
I am kind of protective and possesive about Saad as he was Champion when I was fighting amateur in the late 70's and early 80's. I loved the guy as a fighter-one of my top 5 favorites ever. I consider myself very fortunate to have followed every fight he had on tv as I sat on the edge of my couch at home-screaming at the tv for him to win in those brutal wars and comebacks he had.
But; I like Roy here by stoppage over my personal favorite lightheavyweight ever.
Karl

Ronald Lipton
09-03-2005, 09:23 PM
Jones at his best at 75lbs would outpoint him, but if Saad got into him but good he would make what Glenn Johnson and Tarver did look like kisses from a doll.

Roy would have to really avoid a battle of attrition and shootouts with the durable and never quit Saad, keep it on the outside and show a lot of flash without giving up the tinkle chin.

If he went down like he did with Louis DeValle, Matthew would jump on him like a starving mugger.

On paper it looks like the Roy of old by Unanimous decision.

Steve McV
09-07-2005, 09:00 AM
Here's another "old timer" (add my Dad and Grand Dad, so it's three votes) who think Jones would take it.

However, three votes also on a different topic; Jones vs. Bob Foster. Three votes for Foster; average it all out and it comes to a KO in the 11th or 12th.

Taking nothing away from Jones, he'd whip most of the Light Heavy champs in history; hell, he'd whip a fair number of the Heavies., even fighting at, say, 180-190.

blv30
01-03-2010, 01:34 PM
Roy could win by close to a shutout, but at some point, he's going to get caught, and good.I think Saad wins on a late round stoppage, if it's a 15 round fight.If not, Roy wins a decison.

Michael Frank
01-03-2010, 01:48 PM
Major Saad Muhammad fan here, but I'll take the craftier, faster Jones in this matchup. As does almost everyone above.

I wonder if the anti-Jones-ites on CBZ will favor Saad in this matchup, 4+ years having passed since this thread was started and lots of RJJ-dissing having happened in the meantime!

hawk5ins
01-03-2010, 01:58 PM
that if you have an opposing view in this matchup, you are automatically an "Anti Jones-ite".

So no point in bothering I guess.

Hawk

Elwill7847
01-03-2010, 03:35 PM
I'm an "oldtimer" and would have to lean towards Jones by decision. However, I give Saad a punchers chance and if he can hit Jones he could KO him. The question is would he hit Roy flush.

walshb
01-03-2010, 03:43 PM
A betting man has to go with Saad to maybe land clean. I am always hearing how Jones only suffered his KO losses late on, but the chap was just so fast and elusive at 160-168 lbs, that he was rarely caught clean by mega hitters.

Saad is a big guy fighting in a more comfy division. He has physical advantages here, and was a league or two ahead of Tarver and Johnson.

The lethargic Saad who faced Qawi is pot shotted to defeat. The more energetic and willing Saad gets my vote to KO Jones.

BTW, have seen six of Saad's fights now, I'm catchin' up!

Petey
01-03-2010, 05:02 PM
Not sure if I've ever expressed my opinion on this match-up but...

I'm picturing a post-fight search party looking for Roy's head somehwere around the fifthteenth row.

Saad by dramatic KO after Roy outboxes and outhits him for 11 -13 rounds, depending on how you set the distance. Roy would eventually get caught, and Saad has more then enough power to put Roy down and out with one shot, God help Jones if he did get up anyways!

Put Roy in early 80s, when 175 was a talented division, and I don't think he fares well against Saad, Eddie, Michael Spinks, Qawi, or Pops. I'd say even either of the Davis brothers would have made for an interesting night for Roy...

Go ahead, call me a hater ;)

wolgast
01-03-2010, 07:07 PM
A lot of people were impressed when Roy once defended his 175 title and placed his hands behind his back before knocking out challenger Glen Kelly in seven rounds. People still mention it today when discussing Roy. I would have been more impressed if he Roy had held his hands behind his back against someone like Harold Johnson. Now that would have been impressive--watching Roy crumble to the canvas in sections, like an accordion.

robertk
01-04-2010, 06:34 AM
Agreed.

But those flashy fighters sure do know how to play up the game against the 2nd and 3rd tier guys, don't they? And the guys in the replay booth just love those little 5 second clips.

And you gotta love people using a Glen Kelly as a reference and example of all time boxing prowess. Or a blown up Vinnie Pazienza as one.

hawk5ins
01-04-2010, 10:00 AM
That Vinnie had too much coffee for the Jones bout.

Man. I always loved that response Pazienza gave.

Hawk

TKO11
01-04-2010, 03:29 PM
Was it too much, or just "the wrong time"? I thought he said he took a few shots of espresso to get a caffeine rush, but the fight got delayed so he had a caffeine low instead.

And everyone knows, when you're on a caffeine low it just makes you want to tee your head up for Roy Jones.....

hawk5ins
01-04-2010, 03:39 PM
I just remember when I heard him talk caffeine, I started laughing out loud so hard and all I could think of is when William Hosea after being ko'd in one round by a Pre-title Mike Tyson that the REASON he got ko'd was becuase of the Shoes he was wearing and the soles couldn't grip the canvas.

Yep. it was the Shoes.

Hawk

El Gato
01-04-2010, 05:27 PM
Well, here's a new-timer that thinks Saad takes it by late stoppage. How's that for a change?

Michael Frank
01-04-2010, 09:57 PM
Good to know that if you have an opposing view in this matchup, you are automatically an "Anti Jones-ite".

So no point in bothering I guess.

Hawk
More lying by you to start arguments??

NOBODY said having an opposing view in this matchup makes one "automatically an Anti-Jones-ite," as usual you've gotten it backwards.

My comment was, "I wonder if the anti-Jones-ites on CBZ will favor Saad in this matchup..." That means, to anyone with a brain, that if one is FIRST anti-Jones, will that possibly make him SECOND (chronologically), go and favor Saad in today's matchup(?).

You wrote here that I posted something that I NEVER wrote. What is your problem? Why do you do this?

You are making me wonder if you are truly crazy, Hawkins. You clearly have no logical understanding of a sentence. This isn't the first or second or third time you have mischaracterized what I wrote and then argued against your mischaracterization.

Why do you track down my posts, completely lie about what they say, and then start your shit? (And you have achieved a new record this time, flaming in a whopping 10 minutes after I first posted.) Is your WHOLE existence on this site to start arguments with people over things they NEVER said?

You have PM'd me to say you won't respond to my posts. The post you have lied about didn't address you, so why not stick to your promise? Not that I care either way.

Michael Frank
01-04-2010, 10:09 PM
Not sure if I've ever expressed my opinion on this match-up but...

I'm picturing a post-fight search party looking for Roy's head somehwere around the fifthteenth row.

Saad by dramatic KO after Roy outboxes and outhits him for 11 -13 rounds, depending on how you set the distance. Roy would eventually get caught, and Saad has more then enough power to put Roy down and out with one shot, God help Jones if he did get up anyways!

Put Roy in early 80s, when 175 was a talented division, and I don't think he fares well against Saad, Eddie, Michael Spinks, Qawi, or Pops. I'd say even either of the Davis brothers would have made for an interesting night for Roy...

Go ahead, call me a hater ;)
Hey Petey,

No one's calling you a hater, and I enjoyed your post.

I only question the choice of Eddie Mustafa there, as my own feeling is that Jones will beat even top 175r's who are slow (Saad), who take shots (again Saad), or who are lazy (Eddie--a guy with incredible talent but who rarely fought to his max, despite his fine record). Eddie was lazy in training and often had weight problems, and he fought lazily, often. Hence I like Jones against him and Saad.

I think Pops is your most guaranteed choice to beat Jones. A hard worker, always moving forward and pressuring... perfect to beat Jones at 175.

hawk5ins
01-04-2010, 10:19 PM
"Lying" or is it simply an Interperetation of what was written?

"I wonder if the anti-Jones-ites on CBZ will favor Saad in this matchup..."

I'm guessing I'm not the only one who came away thinking the meaning of this line was that anyone who is "anti-Jones" would favor Saad.

And with that....anyone who favors Saad is "Anti-Jones".

If that isn't what you meant. Simply clarify yourself.

Personally, I keep reading the line and the interperatation still keeps coming out the same to me. Maybe I need to find that other half of the brain......

And maybe you need to stop over reacting. Much in the same way you did in the recent Chandler Tapia Thread. Which you didn't only fly off the handle with me based on your HOF comment (which apparently was a misinterperatation on my part again. I will plead completely guilty on that one in reading what you wrote, incorrectly. I honestly thought you were saying Tapia was in the Hall,whihc I found dumbfounding. Interperatation of dumbfounded being me being aghast at the IBHOF...not YOU.), but also with Philly Fan and 10-8, the latter being about emoticons.

Settle down Beevis.

That all said, I have always favored Saad over Jones and have said so as recently as two months ago in Cliff Rold's Light heavyweight Rankings thread over at the All Time Rankings section.

I've also been critical of Jones, specifically at Light Heavyweight. Which can be found all over this site if one wants to cross reference my poster name and Jones at 175.

So CLEARLY, I must be Anti Jones, at 175 (by my own words as they have appeared on this board) and I DO favor Saad over Jones at 175, as AGAIN, my own posts on this site clearly show.

So back to my original post here:

"So no point in bothering I guess."

Hawk

triplejab34
01-04-2010, 11:23 PM
12 rounds and Jones survives and takes a close decision.15 rounds and Jones is looking for his head after Saad knocks it off.

Petey
01-04-2010, 11:36 PM
Micheal,

On his best night (The time he trained hard) Eddie was a good boxer with a pretty decent punch. Hence why I'd give him a chance against Roy...




Hey Petey,

No one's calling you a hater, and I enjoyed your post.

I only question the choice of Eddie Mustafa there, as my own feeling is that Jones will beat even top 175r's who are slow (Saad), who take shots (again Saad), or who are lazy (Eddie--a guy with incredible talent but who rarely fought to his max, despite his fine record). Eddie was lazy in training and often had weight problems, and he fought lazily, often. Hence I like Jones against him and Saad.

I think Pops is your most guaranteed choice to beat Jones. A hard worker, always moving forward and pressuring... perfect to beat Jones at 175.

El Gato
01-04-2010, 11:50 PM
With all due respect, I beg to differ. Yaqui Lopez boxed Saad's ears off for most of 2 different fights.Nonsense.

hawk5ins
01-05-2010, 08:35 AM
Specifically the first Lopez bout, in which Saad (or then Franklin) boxed briliantly.

Hawk

Michael Frank
01-05-2010, 08:51 AM
"Lying" or is it simply an Interperetation of what was written?

"I wonder if the anti-Jones-ites on CBZ will favor Saad in this matchup..."

I'm guessing I'm not the only one who came away thinking the meaning of this line was that anyone who is "anti-Jones" would favor Saad.

And with that....anyone who favors Saad is "Anti-Jones".

If that isn't what you meant. Simply clarify yourself.

Personally, I keep reading the line and the interperatation still keeps coming out the same to me. Maybe I need to find that other half of the brain......

And maybe you need to stop over reacting. Much in the same way you did in the recent Chandler Tapia Thread. Which you didn't only fly off the handle with me based on your HOF comment (which apparently was a misinterperatation on my part again. I will plead completely guilty on that one in reading what you wrote, incorrectly. I honestly thought you were saying Tapia was in the Hall,whihc I found dumbfounding. Interperatation of dumbfounded being me being aghast at the IBHOF...not YOU.), but also with Philly Fan and 10-8, the latter being about emoticons. . .

. . . Hawk
I was aware that some will favor Jones, and some will favor Saad. But I was wondering aloud if a subset of those who respond to this thread--to wit, those who have made it clear on CBZ that they hold Jones in low regard--if those people would favor Saad here, given that almost everyone preceding my initial post favored Jones.

I spelled all of this out, so, no, my words needed no clarification at all.

Frankly, I can see how one might have misinterpreted it at first blush, but rather than assuming the worst and start ridiculing sarcastically, just ONCE take another look and make sure the guy you're about to ridicule said what you think he said. You might even consider disagreeing with the post without being sarcastic or condescending.

I am saying this in the friendliest vein I can, which is a lot more than the sarcasm that was directed at me here, and on the Chandler-Tapia thread as well (since you've brought that up).

P.S. - To observe a logical fallacy, look at your words, below, and see if you think the reversal you made equates to the non-reversed statement, as you claimed ("And with that..."). You think it does equate, but I assure you that it doesn't.

"I'm guessing I'm not the only one who came away thinking the meaning of this line was that 1) anyone who is "anti-Jones" would favor Saad.

And with that....= 2) anyone who favors Saad is "Anti-Jones".

If that isn't what you meant. Simply clarify yourself."

First, I don't think anyone who is anti-Jones would favor Saad, yet I imagine many of them would and was interested to see who those are. Second, what your rearrangement (#2) of the phrases fails to allow is that one can favor Saad and yet not be anti-Jones. Nothing I wrote precluded that obvious possibility. My words and your rearrangement of them are not synonymous.

My curiosity was only about the group of people on CBZ already anti-Jones, wondering who among them would favor Saad, given that Jones has some real advantages here, making him the favorite to virtually everyone who posted prior to my initial post. The anti-Jones people would thus be going against the grain, and I was curious what their rationale would be.

hawk5ins
01-05-2010, 09:23 AM
Interperatation of your post was that the two WERE synonomous.

Again, I would venture to guess that others made that interperatation as well.

If Indeed they were not, or your intent was that they were not, then all that was needed here was a clarification on your part.

Nothing more. Nothing less.

If you want to continue on that there are posters who are out to "get you" or that I am "LYING" on purpose, well knock yourself out.

Clarifying what you meant, without all the other guff, was all that was needed.

End of the day as it pertains to the subject matter, regardless of my feelings on Jones, whether YOU or anyone else interperates them to be ANTI-Jones or not, I beleive Saad wins the matchup between the two.

Have said as much for some time now. Before Jones lost to Tarver and Johnson and after it and well after it up to today as well.

Hawk

SageBrush
01-05-2010, 01:09 PM
My six-penneth will not add anything new, suffice it to say if pitched in with the premier 70's Lt heavy's i think Mr Jones would notice an incredible differance in capabilities to the Lt Heavy's he crossed Swords with, Cetainly i would favour a classy Prime and Vicious Conteh to Beat him, And perhaps Lesser Talents, to drag him into a spot of Trench warfare and put him into a Shell, No disrespect to Jones, marvoulsy talented, but perhaps competition like Clinton Woods does help flatter to deceive ?

Saad of course was nearly beaten by Murray sutherland on a cut lip, led a dance by Vonzell Jonhson, and of course was outboxed for long streches by the faded Conteh before the usual Saad Catch-up kicked in, and due to styles, and perhaps with Jones being Ultra respectful i can see him taking a clear lead into the second half, by which time he will know that Saad is on his usual seek and destroy mission, he will probably have made saad miss and relised the damage that would of been caused had the punch landed. I think Jones is fully capable of staying one step of Saad for the points win ...over 12rounds

Over 15 i am not so confident of a Jones Hit and Flit to Victory, When i recall the suddeness in change of fortunes that Many of Saad's opponents suffered , by dint of one punch, or two, Ala Lottie Mwale, it cant be emphersised enough that if Jones Zigs when he should Zag ...he's in Saads bag ! Jones is the very tentative pick, but i would expect him to look unusally panicky doing it !

JLP 6
01-05-2010, 03:44 PM
Heck, I would rather lose going hard than win panicky. Yo, Sage did you get my PM about Mayweather-Pacquaio? If you don't have time, no sweat, but just wanted you take on their match-up if it takes place.

walshb
01-05-2010, 04:37 PM
You are making me wonder if you are truly crazy, Hawkins.

Rainman wasn't crazy!:)

Dan Gunter
01-05-2010, 04:49 PM
My six-penneth will not add anything new, suffice it to say if pitched in with the premier 70's Lt heavy's i think Mr Jones would notice an incredible differance in capabilities to the Lt Heavy's he crossed Swords with, Cetainly i would favour a classy Prime and Vicious Conteh to Beat him, And perhaps Lesser Talents, to drag him into a spot of Trench warfare and put him into a Shell, No disrespect to Jones, marvoulsy talented, but perhaps competition like Clinton Woods does help flatter to deceive ?

Saad of course was nearly beaten by Murray sutherland on a cut lip, led a dance by Vonzell Jonhson, and of course was outboxed for long streches by the faded Conteh before the usual Saad Catch-up kicked in, and due to styles, and perhaps with Jones being Ultra respectful i can see him taking a clear lead into the second half, by which time he will know that Saad is on his usual seek and destroy mission, he will probably have made saad miss and relised the damage that would of been caused had the punch landed. I think Jones is fully capable of staying one step of Saad for the points win ...over 12rounds

Over 15 i am not so confident of a Jones Hit and Flit to Victory, When i recall the suddeness in change of fortunes that Many of Saad's opponents suffered , by dint of one punch, or two, Ala Lottie Mwale, it cant be emphersised enough that if Jones Zigs when he should Zag ...he's in Saads bag ! Jones is the very tentative pick, but i would expect him to look unusally panicky doing it !

Excellent analysis.

Michael Frank
01-05-2010, 06:08 PM
If you want to continue on that #1 there are posters who are out to "get you" or #2 that I am "LYING" on purpose, well knock yourself out.

Hawk
Here again, I didn't say or imply part 1 at all (except in regards to yourself); just part 2.

What I wrote was, "Frankly, I can see how one might have misinterpreted it at first blush, but rather than assuming the worst and start ridiculing sarcastically, just ONCE take another look and make sure the guy you're about to ridicule said what you think he said. You might even consider disagreeing with the post without being sarcastic or condescending."

That's what I said, what I meant, and what I will reaffirm now.

hawk5ins
01-05-2010, 06:22 PM
Hope you can sleep at night now having "cleared this all up."

Hawk

sr71ko
01-05-2010, 07:47 PM
Saad was stronger and a bigger puncher at light heavyweight, but that porous defense against Jones would be a liability. I will go against my for instincts and take MSM by late kayo because as much as I love a prime Roy Jones, I do feel that he is overrated at 175. I can't picture him beating any of the top 175 lbs champs. Foster, Charles, Moore, Spinks, or Conn? Most likely no. But Jones's speed and power would give him a chance. But what happens when they land bombs on Roy? We found out against Tarver and he was good but not even close to being great.

hawk5ins
01-06-2010, 10:42 AM
"Saad was stronger and a bigger puncher at light heavyweight, but that porous defense against Jones would be a liability."

This sums up my entire issue with Jones at 175. His make up as a fighter. Specifically at this weight class.

YES, he would have opportunity to land on Saad becuase of the leaky defense, but I have a VERY difficult time seeing Jones trying to expose this BECAUSE of the Power that Saad possessed.

He is GOING to have to get in range to land and land consistantly. I don't think at 175, JOnes wants ANYTHING To do with the power that Saad can return with and thus plays it so safe and minimizes any amount of exchanges and action that this would be pretty dull for a close to 8 or 9 rounds of the bout.

Eventually Saad is going to kick it into gear, close the distance and start landing. When he does, Jones WILL tie up and try to smother Saad, but the determination and will of Saad is going to see him break through.

He WILL begin connecting and connecting hard. Around the 10th or 11th round, he hits Jones who in all probability will be clowning in a showing of false bravado and he goes down hard. He gets up, but Saad finishes the show.

Hawk

hagler04
01-06-2010, 01:35 PM
My six-penneth will not add anything new, suffice it to say if pitched in with the premier 70's Lt heavy's i think Mr Jones would notice an incredible differance in capabilities to the Lt Heavy's he crossed Swords with, Cetainly i would favour a classy Prime and Vicious Conteh to Beat him, And perhaps Lesser Talents, to drag him into a spot of Trench warfare and put him into a Shell, No disrespect to Jones, marvoulsy talented, but perhaps competition like Clinton Woods does help flatter to deceive ?

Saad of course was nearly beaten by Murray sutherland on a cut lip, led a dance by Vonzell Jonhson, and of course was outboxed for long streches by the faded Conteh before the usual Saad Catch-up kicked in, and due to styles, and perhaps with Jones being Ultra respectful i can see him taking a clear lead into the second half, by which time he will know that Saad is on his usual seek and destroy mission, he will probably have made saad miss and relised the damage that would of been caused had the punch landed. I think Jones is fully capable of staying one step of Saad for the points win ...over 12rounds

Over 15 i am not so confident of a Jones Hit and Flit to Victory, When i recall the suddeness in change of fortunes that Many of Saad's opponents suffered , by dint of one punch, or two, Ala Lottie Mwale, it cant be emphersised enough that if Jones Zigs when he should Zag ...he's in Saads bag ! Jones is the very tentative pick, but i would expect him to look unusally panicky doing it !


I agree with all of the above. One thing I do think should be noted is that Roy was no power-puff puncher at 175 . . .not the puncher he was at middleweight, but a one round demolition of Griffith and the one punch body shot of Hill shows he had some considerable pop. Saad may not be as eager to go all damn the torpedoes on such a quick counterer as Roy, as opposed to a Yaqui Lopez.

hawk5ins
01-06-2010, 01:42 PM
May not have been intentional, but it was a Kidney punch.

Hawk

Petey
01-06-2010, 01:56 PM
Hawk,

Kidney shot or no, give Roy credit here: Old as he was at the time, at least Hill's primary occupation was professional boxer!

hawk5ins
01-06-2010, 02:17 PM
from me there!

I'll also credit Jones on the Griffin KO as well. To a degree though.

I think Montell SERIOUSLY handicapped himself by thinking he did not need Eddie Futch.

That and I've simply never been all that impressed with Montell Griffin. In fact, I've always felt he didn't really deserve the two Toney bouts. Two fights where NEITHER fighter looked any good.

Hawk

hagler04
01-06-2010, 05:31 PM
from me there!

I'll also credit Jones on the Griffin KO as well. To a degree though.

I think Montell SERIOUSLY handicapped himself by thinking he did not need Eddie Futch.

That and I've simply never been all that impressed with Montell Griffin. In fact, I've always felt he didn't really deserve the two Toney bouts. Two fights where NEITHER fighter looked any good.

Hawk


I agree on that one. Particularly in the rematch, Toney was robbed big-time.

But Griffith had a solid chin, and seriously Futch would've made no difference in that fight. Roy is also the only guy to ever stop Clinton Woods inside the distance.

Again, not great power, but enough to get guys' respect.

hawk5ins
01-06-2010, 06:02 PM
And IF he had the mindset to go with that Power, it could prove to be formidible agianst the The Greats and or at least the elites of the divisions past.

I don't think he has that to truly take advantage of it though. NOT at 175.

Saad is going to start slow as it is anyhow. Jones is going to be cautious.

So it's going to be tedious for the first several rounds as it is.

When Saad starts kicking it in, is about the time Jones typically puts it in auto-pilot anyhow. Can't see him all of a sudden opening up when Saad starts pushing him.

I see lots of holding and histrionics and taunting and FALSE bravado. But I don't see Jones Opening up agianst the power and determination and energy that Saad is going to start brining around round 8 or 9.

Hawk

El Gato
01-06-2010, 06:30 PM
The chances of Jones stopping Saad are slim and none, and slim's gone MIA. He couldn't stop bums like David Telesco despite hitting him with everything but the kitchen sink. Jones just wasn't the killer at LHW (particularly against bigger men, aside from the body shot KO on Hill) that he was at 160 and 168. He was much more of the defensive cutie type on the whole, albeit with a big punch to keep his opponents honest. Still, I think his power at the weight is often overrated. He'd outbox Saad for the most part, though even that wouldn't have been half as easy as people seem to be making out, as Saad would be the best all around boxer-puncher he'd ever faced at any weight. Down the stretch of the fight though, especially over 15 rounds, I just don't think Jones had the durability to hang with Saad. He'd be getting hit a lot more than he's used to over the course of the fight, and make no mistake those punches would take their toll.

Over 12 rounds his chances of winning a decision increase, but even still I wouldn't outright favor him. Saad's technical skills get low-balled too much for my liking. The guy wasn't just a gutsy slugger in the Graziano mold, he was a very sound boxer-puncher as well, with a myriad of excellent tools at his disposal.

walshb
01-06-2010, 06:40 PM
Jones' reflexes and speed at 175 weren't the same as the 160-168 lb reflexes.
A fraction slower everywhere. If a Glen Johnosn and Tarver can nail him and take him,
then a peak Saad can. His chin is questionable. His wins at 175 were aginst lesser
fighters than Saad or Spinks or Qawi. Although he looked good, I don't think
it's good enough.

vic_roc_13
01-06-2010, 06:48 PM
Saad is a true warrior, RJJ truely overrated .Saad had too much horsepower ,which would catchup too Jones in the late RDS !

mrbig1
01-06-2010, 07:35 PM
Saad is a true warrior, RJJ truely overrated .Saad had too much horsepower ,which would catchup too Jones in the late RDS !
God bless you sir. I've been saying the same thing for years. The worst was when Jones beat Ruiz. His fans were saying he could beat the Ali of 1967 and the Joe Louis of 1940.

Petey
01-07-2010, 03:10 PM
Ali at any stage would have dropped Roy as soon as he finished out-clowning him. Louis would've walked thru Jones like an open doorway...

robertk
01-13-2010, 07:55 AM
A big reason I tend to go with Jones in this is that Saad Muhammad gear of his. Man, when he went into top gear he was a destroyer of the highest order. And I sure don't see Jones dealing with that guy whatsoever. But kind of like EMM, Saad just liked that 2nd and 3rd gear of his. If he got tagged hard or cut he'd change gears and the other guy had to watch out.

I just think Jones is/was perfectly capable of fighting a negative type bout. I'm sure Jones would not have been a fan favorite at the Blue Horizon for his tactics in a bout like this. But I think he'd keep Saad in those lower gears and not even try to ko the guy or finish him. Never exchange with the guy. Just a safety first pick and peck and pose bout. But it'd be a tightrope act and either a nasty left hook or big right hand could end the bout. I think it take the best performance of Jones' career to beat the guy, and I think he'd win it on the cards in a stinker type bout.

If there was a rematch, I think Saad does something different and uses 4th gear and gets the ko. A brutal ko, and probably put Jones up there with Tate in the brutal ko by department.