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View Full Version : Pavlik-Lockett Results & Discussion 7/7/08



GorDoom
06-07-2008, 07:11 AM
Zev will do the honors tonight. Please keep all discussion of this card to this thread. Redundant threads will be deleted.

thanks,

GorDoom

prototypeofamodernmadman
06-07-2008, 11:08 AM
Hi guys, in diggity's previous thread asking how we think this card will play out, I put some bookmaker odds from a gambling website as a reply, I donít want to encourage gambling, or refer people to that particular website or anything, I did want to add some comments at the bottom but I was at work,

anyway, the odds are just a good benchmark on what most people feel the outcome is going to be, I was surprised to see Quintana as an underdog again, people must really feel that Williams looked past him and will make the proper adjustments tonight,

as for Lockett, I remember seeing him years ago, I think he fought on American television once, he had just about all of his wins by knockout at that time and was being heavily hyped in the UK, he looked awful and amateurish and I never heard from him again, Pavlik should crush him.

Off The River
06-07-2008, 05:36 PM
All over, Lopez lands a beauty of a short right hook which knocked DeLeon down and hurt him badly. He stalked him well and finished him with about 40 seconds left in round one!!

Zevl
06-07-2008, 05:37 PM
Good evening,


Early results from Atlantic City:

Unbeaten junior featherweight Juan Manuel Lopez (22-0, 20 KOs) is a world champion after destroying reigning WBO champion Daniel Ponce De Leon (34-2, 30 KOs) in just 2:25 of round one.

Unbeaten WBO #3, IBF #4 super featherweight Kevin Mitchell (27-0, 20 KOs) scored a fifth round TKO over former world title challenger Walter Estrada (32-6, 23 KOs).

Super lightweight Demetrio Soto (4-0, 4 KOs) needed just 58 seconds to demolish Gustavo Mejia (2-3-1, 2 KOs).

Bantamweight Jorge Diaz (5-0, 4 KOs) went the route for the first time, taking a one-sided six round nod over Gino Escamilla (5-2-1, 2 KOs).

Super welterweight Eberto Medina (2-3-1, 1 KO) won a four round majority decision over Arman Ovsepian (0-1) by scores of 40-36, 39-37, 38-38.

Zevl
06-07-2008, 05:57 PM
Round One

Pavlik lands a few jabs to start. Lockett trying to jab to the body. Lockett lands a right hand, Pavlik responds with a right of his own which backs Lockett into a corner. Pavlik starting to throw combinations off the jab. Pavlik's round.

Zevl
06-07-2008, 06:02 PM
Round Two

Right hand lands immediately for Pavlik. Right to the body by Pavlik. Lockett having a hard time finding Pavlik. A couple of clean right hands forces Lockett to take a knee. Pavlik uses straight hard shots on Lockett. Pavlik floors Lockett again towards the end of the round with a barrage of punches. Pavlik's round by three points.

Zevl
06-07-2008, 06:05 PM
Round Three

Pavlik continues the slow assault on Lockett. Lockett trying to throw more this round but not landing much of anything. Pavlik putting his punches together beautifully now, going upstairs and downstairs. Pavlik floors Lockett once again with a nice right hand. Lockett's corner throws the towel in and referee Eddie Cotton stops the fight.

gregbeyer
06-07-2008, 06:30 PM
whewww.....tough nite at the key board huh zev. probaly have your fingers in an ice bucket right now....reaching for the chablis.

ponce de leon proved tonite that no matter how hard you hit or how strong you are......a little defence never hurts...at least not that much...ouch!

how locket became a mandatory is a mystery. kelly was a hot knife thru butter.

enzo should stick with his kid...nuff said.

greg

evander
06-07-2008, 06:34 PM
Finally!! Someone finally exposed Deleon for the club fighter he really was. Lopez's performance reminded me of Delahoya's performance vs Ruelas. Lopez was totally in a different league.

kikibalt
06-07-2008, 06:41 PM
Pavlik did what a good or great champion does when he fight an over-match opponent, get him out fast.

evander
06-07-2008, 06:49 PM
I liked the fluidity on how Pavlik moved his hands.

Ron Lipton
06-07-2008, 06:53 PM
Good job, thats the way its done Mr. Pettibone, good body shots too.

Pavlik doesn't look like he has a muscle developed in his whole body yet is definitely a powerful fighter, great sinew and couplings and hard work. Good job. Pavlik v Abraham, Calzaghe, Roy Jones would be interesting.

True, he was very fluid, well done.

Ron Lipton
06-07-2008, 07:03 PM
Maybe its just me, but I always felt refereeing should rise to the occassion of a title fight by the ref giving a refined instruction, performance etc.

These gutteral comments always turned me off, "Get poppin, C'mon baby ad infinitum. That is not for the ref to say, a typical NYSAC Ron Scott Stevens protege. This same ref during past fights talks to the fighters like they are all on a street corner. Is any Commisison member at ringside actually watching anymore and realize this is on worldwide TV, can't they refine things or is it there are no more boxing men at ringside who know any better?

I remember Mercante Jr yelling to the fighters in the last round, "WHO WANTS IT MORE," egging them on to fight, then calling them by their nicknames, C'mon Blade, C'mon Schoolboy in the Barkley v Van Horne fight of yore, or when Lewis v Mercer was voted a draw by one judge, he made a face of disapproval on camera, what is with these guys the way they act in the ring? I guess one of the worst things I ever saw was the way the first Abraham V Miranda fight was handled and the broken jaw was allowed to exist to the end without a stoppage. An utter DISGRACE of ineptness and ignorance with total disregard for the fighter's life.

Despite past tensions with Mercante Sr, he would verbally only, rise to the occassion with refined language.

Every ref I see with rare exception seems so grossly out of shape, speaks gutteral gibberish to the fighters, and is the pal of someone getting them the assignment, it is getting worse and worse.

Mike Ortega did a good job.

evander
06-07-2008, 07:09 PM
Maybe its just me, but I always felt refereeing should rise to the occassion of a title fight by the ref giving a refined instruction, performance etc.

These gutteral comments always turned me off, "Get poppin, C'mon baby ad infinitum. That is not for the ref to say, a typical NYSAC Ron Scott Stevens protege. This same ref during past fights talks to the fighters like they are all on a street corner. Is any Commisison member at ringside actually watching anymore and realize this is on worldwide TV, can't they refine things or is it there are no more boxing men at ringside who know any better?

I remember Mercante Jr yelling to the fighters in the last round, "WHO WANTS IT MORE," egging them on to fight, then calling them by their nicknames, C'mon Blade, C'mon Schoolboy in the Barkley v Van Horne fight of yore, or when Lewis v Mercer was voted a draw by one judge, he made a face of disapproval on camera, what is with these guys the way they act in the ring? I guess one of the worst things I ever saw was the way the first Abraham V Miranda fight was handled and the broken jaw was allowed to exist to the end without a stoppage. An utter DISGRACE of ineptness and ignorance with total disregard for the fighter's life.

Despite past tensions with Mercante Sr, he would verbally only, rise to the occassion with refined language.

Every ref I see with rare exception seems so grossly out of shape, speaks gutteral gibberish to the fighters, and is the pal of someone getting them the assignment, it is getting worse and worse.

Mike Ortega did a good job.

Maybe it's just me, but i hate "I'm fair but i'm firm!" I can't stand Cortez! He strikes me as one of those guys who think people come to see him ref, rather than watching the fighters.

Ron Lipton
06-07-2008, 07:15 PM
All that shit, What I say you must obey, I'm fair but I'm firm, is so bush league, it makes many fans hurl, and I've read that in many places and been told it too.

Nothing will stop them including others killing fighters through negligence from refereeing over and over as long as their "Commish" pals from Long Island, NY and elsewhere still influence selections. Some of these lil darlings actually still try to pull the strings and want to come back as boss again. LOL

Dan Gunter
06-07-2008, 07:25 PM
Not a great fight, but Pavlik again shows that he punches like the average mule kicking.

PeteLeo
06-07-2008, 07:34 PM
Good job, thats the way its done Mr. Pettibone,


HARD TIMES! HARD TIMES! HARD TIMES! I love that movie! PeteLeo.

Ron Lipton
06-07-2008, 08:01 PM
Maybe someday the guys sitting ringside collecting checks will actually care about the fighter's lives instead of rewarding their POLITICAL HACK buddies with referee and judge assignments based on cronyism, and even race.

Ron Lipton
06-07-2008, 08:10 PM
Pete,

I just knew you would get that one. thanks for not disappointing me.

diggity
06-07-2008, 08:42 PM
Is there a better right hook in the sport than Lopez's? That was a thing of beauty. He can throw that thing in a phonebooth and KO a mule.

Pavlik looked excellent IMO. Exactly what you want a champion to do with a defense like that. No showboating, no nonsense, all business. I can't imagine how devastating this kid's punches are. Lockett was getting hurt badly through the guard. How can you not love this kid?

Ron Lipton
06-07-2008, 08:57 PM
Oh, yeah, beautiful right hook by Lopez, that definitelly did the job, thats the kind of fight boxing needs. Both guys in shape and came to fight.

I thought the ghost logo on Pavilik's trunks was pretty cool too.

Michael Frank
06-07-2008, 09:14 PM
Maybe it's just me, but i hate "I'm fair but i'm firm!" I can't stand Cortez! He strikes me as one of those guys who think people come to see him ref, rather than watching the fighters.
Yeah, Evander, I hate Cortez's self-promotion just like I never liked Mills Lane's similar tag line. These refs think they are the entertainment rather than leaving that to the fighters or even to the ring announcers like Michael Buffer and Jimmy Lennon, who are SUPPOSED to arouse crowd interest. Whereas they say the best ref is unnoticed. I always thought Larry Hazzard tried too much to be flamboyant, too.

Before Richard Steele got his (unfair IMO) bad raps over Chavez-Taylor #1 and Tyson-Ruddock #1, he seemed at the top of the class, along with Davey Pearl, of the refs I saw on big fights. I never liked Mercante Sr., who actually wouldn't penalize a flagrantly-fouling Wilfredo Gomez and explained that he was afraid the Puerto Rican fans would assault him if he did! Helluva reason.

A little dignity on a referee's part such as the late Jim McKay had in abundance would be noticed by people . . . though the ref should not waste one second on trying to be noticed.

PeteLeo
06-07-2008, 09:20 PM
Pete,

I just knew you would get that one. thanks for not disappointing me.


Speed to Poe as they watch Chaney ride away into the darkness: "Awww . . . he sure was somethin'."

Maybe my favorite line of dialogue ever, even better than anything I've written myself (and I'm an out-of-control egotist). PeteLeo.

Ron Lipton
06-07-2008, 09:22 PM
We are on the same page on that one, and at least they did not forget the cat.

Ron Lipton
06-07-2008, 09:54 PM
Yeah, Evander, I hate Cortez's self-promotion just like I never liked Mills Lane's similar tag line. These refs think they are the entertainment rather than leaving that to the fighters or even to the ring announcers like Michael Buffer and Jimmy Lennon, who are SUPPOSED to arouse crowd interest. Whereas they say the best ref is unnoticed. I always thought Larry Hazzard tried too much to be flamboyant, too.

Before Richard Steele got his (unfair IMO) bad raps over Chavez-Taylor #1 and Tyson-Ruddock #1, he seemed at the top of the class, along with Davey Pearl, of the refs I saw on big fights.

I never liked Mercante Sr., who actually wouldn't penalize a flagrantly-fouling Wilfredo Gomez and explained that he was afraid the Puerto Rican fans would assault him if he did! Helluva reason.


A little dignity on a referee's part such as the late Jim McKay had in abundance would be noticed by people . . . though the ref should not waste one second on trying to be noticed.


Reply:

Reply: The MOST over rated referee ever, who was given every assignment through political connections. He scored fights for boxers over punchers and told me in person he "Liked" boxers better. He screwed so many punchers out of deserved wins it is infamous. I DO NOT wish him ill despite what he did behind the scenes to me personally. We both are older now and I wish no one any wrong.

What is hideously objectionable to boxing itself is that he was pals with a famous NY manager, his dear pal and guru to the obseqious ass kissers who continue to make us believe they worship these guys just to curry recognition and favor with them to this day, Senior played the NY-Long Island connection game and ALWAYS gave HIS fighters the edge in scoring where he NEVER should have been assigned to that manager's fighter's bouts.

He also established a "Relationship" with one alphabet group and got used so much by them no one cared or noticed what he actually did in that ring.
I used to see him at their conventions brown nosing his way into one European assignment after another for him and his kid. The famous manager's partner shilled for the kid at the expense of anything and everything which backfired in his face causing him to get fired among making unfair matches.

Pulled so many manuvers behind the scenes with his Republican connections in NY State and alphabet boy manuverings, friendships with boxing writers, I hand it to him, a boxing coup nothing short of mass hypnotism, the least of which is creating the nightmare personna of the Huntz Hall of referees Art Jr.
Hey, it worked, he got a political hack job for free and the kid still referees despite being the angel of death. Politics are everything, skill means nothing.

Junior who was manuvered into one title fight after another by "Boy" Commissioners who shoved him down the throat of everyone until he finally killed a guy through negligence after a myriad of warning signs all ignored because of the family name. I mean who cares about the fighter's lives, right?

If you knew the background of some of the referees you have seen recently you would not believe it even while you were reading it. Bakeries, fast food business, prison refs, famous fathers, poltical hacks, pot bellies down to the floor, alkies, rum dums, coming into the ring red faced with beers behind them,
letting guys fight on with brain injuries, broken jaws, screwing up fights one after another, arguing with cornermen in mid ring, choking fighters, giving mid ring instructions, saying, Lets do it baby, Lets get poppin, Who wants it more, what I say you must obey, I'm fair but I'm firm, on and on.

If you are in shape, know what you are doing, do it well, you will get blackballed as fast as possible whether it be as a ref or a judge. Some hall of fames have guys that vote people in not on accomplishment but whether they like them or not. You know who votes, the actual officials who vote each other in, and contribute legal advice as lawyers, blackball others and then compliment in the most sugary manner the bosses who cannot see what they are doing, or more so care.

Its a sweet thing they have going, like a private social club under camoflauge.
That is how the Commissions, and certain Hall of fames are run.

Nothing means nothing, except the manipulation behind the scenes.


One or two good federal suits should at least expose some of it.

KOJOE90
06-08-2008, 03:48 AM
Pavlik did what had to be done. He looked very calm, relaxed in there, last night he was a fighter in total control of the situation at hand. Lockett is a good fighter but Pavlik is a very good fighter, it's often about differnt levels in Boxing at this fight showed it with all due respect to Lockett.

Pavlik just didn't allow Lockett to fight his fight. He used those long accurate punishing shots to keep Lockett at bay and off his game. Lockett was very smart to take the the knee when hurt, although it did just delay the final outcome it was the smart thing to do at the time. Lockett has always seemed like a real nice guy so I hope he was well paid and that this fight has not taken anything out of him. He fought for the World Title and that will be something he can tell his grandchildren about in years to come.

We could be in for a fun few years with Pavlik although he is still not the next Hagler in my opinion.

As for Eddie Cotton, was it just me or did he seem to almost 'blank' Lockett during the pre-fight instructions?

prototypeofamodernmadman
06-08-2008, 11:26 AM
I know it's way too early but fightnews is posting that there are negotiations under way for a Pavlik vs. Calzaghe for October, to me, Calzaghe looked awful in the Hopkins fight, I know, Hopkins is difficult all that but hopkins completely controlled that fight imo, landed the cleaner harder shots, and had calzaghe completely stumped, and I can;t remember seeing Calzaghe land a single clean punch, anyway,

if Calzaghe wants to retire undefeated, and I know it is really important for him, he should just fight Roy Jones in the fall and retire, Pavlik will most likely brutalize him with his constant work rate, youth, stamina, and hard punch,

Ron Lipton
06-08-2008, 11:34 AM
Either Calzaghe had a stale bad night against a man over 40 years old, plus the fact BHOP is difficult to fight or he has been to the well too many times.
Looks like Pavlik beats him right now unless Joe turns up the hand speed and comes in on time strong, moving and using all his skills to outpoint him.

I see Pavlik stopping him if they clash soon.

hagler04
06-08-2008, 02:03 PM
Who has EVER looked good vs Hopkins? A prime Roy was even negated by Hopkins for the most part.

People always seem to go off the rails when an established champ looks great against an opponent who's completly not supposed to be there.

Calzaghe takes Pavlik to school and back, you heard it here first. Pavlik hasn't shown me anything Kessler wasn't showing before he got undressed in Wales.

Ron Lipton
06-08-2008, 02:33 PM
This is very possible, and I can see that scenario too, if Calzaghe is in tip top shape, I am still always surprised by Pavlik's punches, I don't see the power yet it is there, very very deceiving.

evander
06-08-2008, 02:40 PM
Pavilk just has very heavy hands.

hagler04
06-08-2008, 05:10 PM
This is very possible, and I can see that scenario too, if Calzaghe is in tip top shape, I am still always surprised by Pavlik's punches, I don't see the power yet it is there, very very deceiving.

That is right, Pavlik is one of those very lean, wiry guys with the super sinewy strength that they are just born with (coupled with hard training of course)

Lopez really shocked me. Ponce always had awful defense but he was always extremly durable. JML deserves a fight with either of the fellow champs in that division Caballero and Vasquez, both of which I would be very interested to see.

diggity
06-08-2008, 08:26 PM
Although a landed punch by Pavlik is a lot less forgiving than Kessler's, Calzaghe will give Pavlik many problems. Trying to gauge where Calzaghe is at by his performance with BHop is pointless although the way I see it, he is the only person to beat him clearly since RJJ. It's a very interesting fight. The Calzaghe that beat Kessler & Lacy beats too Pavlik IMO. I'd love to see it but I think Calzaghe stays away from that one. Much more to lose than gain.

greek1237
06-09-2008, 05:20 PM
Pavlik would win imo. I just have that gut feeling, it will be a war though.

Thomas44
06-10-2008, 01:35 AM
Pavlik's speed impressed me and his take care of business attitude, he is a no nonsense guy.

I think he wins more rounds against Calzaghe than Kessler did (117-111 on my card) , just from throwing more punches I'd say Calzaghe wins 115-113

I don't see anyone beating Calzaghe by out boxing him , you have to bring your clubs and attempt to lay a royal beat down on the guy. I still give the edge to Calzaghe in a hell of a fight.

Off The River
06-10-2008, 03:44 AM
I think Pavlik has enough of a workrate to score enough and maybe even stop Joe at this point in is career. It is nice to see most guys giving Calzaghe some credit for a change.

Paulie W
06-11-2008, 11:19 AM
Ideal scenario for me is Joe fights Pavlik and wins a barnburner that cements Cal's status as a great fighter but whick also marks out Kelly as a genuine talent - beating Miranda, Taylor and Lockett (!) does not not do that. Kelly then fights Kessler and triumphs, just, in another storming contest.

In reality, depsite the fact Pavlik just fought Cal's stablemate and there was all that banter between Enzo and Pavlik's team, I'm far from convicned that the fight will take place. The Jones Jnr name and the money he brings with him might prove too enticing for Joe (that and the fact that it looks like the less painful night). If they do fight, however, I fear that Joe may have jumped the shark in the Hopkins' fight. Cal still has a great work rate but his reflexes are a lot slower and I can see him getting caught a lot which against a guy like Pavlik cannot be a good thing.

Antonia Margarita
06-11-2008, 09:31 PM
calzone will undress him. you cant compare pavliks speed and movement to hopkins. nowhere close to the same ballpark
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doomeddisciple
06-12-2008, 12:03 PM
Personally, I'd much rather see Mr Pavlik fight Arthur Abraham than Joe.

A more significant fight for the 160 lbs division and makes for a more entertaining stylistical match up for my money.

Makes the Miranda rematch more interesting anyway.

HARDTIMES
06-12-2008, 12:20 PM
Did you guys see Lopez' feint of the right hook, then throw the straight left, followed by the right hook? He really torqued his body on the feint and totally sold it to DeLeon, then crushed him with the follow ups. A thing of beauty.