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Thread: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

  1. #121
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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    Quote Originally Posted by El Gato
    You don't think he did just that on Saturday? Directly after being hurt worse than he'd ever been in his career he opted to press the fight and essentially gave Shane a beating the rest of the night. He was angered and embarassed, and made Shane pay. Had he adopted a Hector Camacho approach those flaws would've been evident for all to see. Clearly that wasn't the case. I dislike Floyd as a person, but he proved something to me on Saturday where his fighter's spirit is concerned.
    I don't consider it all that huge of a feat when a guy survives being momentarily stunned or hurt once for a few seconds of a fight, no. It's not like Floyd immediately came back firing and taking the play away from Shane ala Holyfield-Bowe (1st fight, round 10[?]). He got stunned and stayed pretty defensive the rest of the round. Nothing spectacular that made you go "WOW! What courage!" Shane didn't follow up so Floyd just took him apart. Other than that brief few seconds in that second round I don't see Floyd being pressed that hard and coming back to shift the tide of battle. He got hurt. He clinched and recovered. The round ended. Shane offered next to nothing from the 3rd round on, so Floyd said "OK" and diced him. No problem for PBF.

    I have yet to see PBF survive a true gut check vs a fighter who truly is given a good chance of beating him going into the bout.
    Last edited by Surf-Bat; 05-03-2010 at 07:52 PM.

  2. #122
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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    Courage under fire to me is Archie Moore being floored repeatedly but coming back to KO Yvonne Durelle. Rocky Marciano and Marvin Hagler having their faces torn open(by Charles and Hearns respectively) and wading back in guns ablazing to KO their opponents. Ray Leonard getting speared to death by Tommy Hearns ("You're blowin' it son! You're blowin' it!") and coming back to take out the hitman.

    Even John Mugabi getting clobbered by Hagler yet finding the will and fury to slug back in that 6th round. Pernell Whitaker- coke ravaged and with nothing left to offer but heart and a bit of speed- tearing into Felix Trinidad(a suicide mission if ever there was one!) hoping to expose what many thought was a shakey chin, his only hope for victory. DeLaHoya roaring back and flooring Ike Quartey to secure the win after a brutal fight. If I may dare say, even the pathetically overmatched Vinny Pazienza vs. a prime Roy Jones, tearing in there round after round, trying every second to will the fight his way.

    THESE to me are examples of courage. Gut checks of the first order. No way does a few anxious seconds vs an aged Shane Mosley merit Floyd a mention as having "spirit" or "courage".

    I dunno...maybe my standards are just too high. Sue me.


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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    I agree with most of what is being said. Shane was indeed past his prime, that much has been evident for years now. However, he didn't just gas in the second round. After hurting Floyd, being unable to finish the job, and the fight being taken to him afterwards, he clammed up mentally more than anything. The same has happened in the past, notably in the first Forrest fight. Mosley, as tough as he is, is not an adaptable fighter at all. Floyd is, which is what enabled him to shut Shane down for the rest of the fight.

    Mosley's inactivity had to do with blowing his mental load after being unable to finish Floyd, age deterring him from pushing the pace up a notch afterward, and Floyd taking the play away from him from then on out. A younger Shane would've likely given a much more spirited effort, but eventually I suspect that Floyd would shut him down technically in much the same way, allowing for him to cruise through the rest of the fight. I highly doubt that Shane stops him, especially a younger Floyd with better reflexes. The same scenario likely wouldn't have even presented itself in that case.

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    Round two was a courageous showing by both. Round three, mayweather came from the corner directly cater Shane. Can disagree just to disagree. But the facts remain the same. Mayweather closed out round 2 strong, but from the corner to open round 3 it was a different aggressive dominating mayweather that took it too Mosley.

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    Mosley reminded me a bit of Vinny Paz against Roy Jones, all jittery, jumpy, flinchy...and throwing zero punches.

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    Quote Originally Posted by wpink
    Revisit how Floyd came out after mosley starting round 3. It's pretty evident floyd became much more aggressive.

    Not arguing that mosley was gassed, I can concur that point. But it's not only because of Mosley. Mayweather had a lot to do with him wearing down.

    How? He never upped his punch output, and indeed Mosley was gassed late in the second after trying a fairly half hearted attack to finish Floyd. Its funny that because Floyd was moving forward and side to side as opposed to backwards he is somehow suddenly an offensive monster according to some. His punch output was right at where it has always been. In his five fights at WW he lands an average of 17 punches a round, throws an average of 37, and connects at 46%. Guess what his numbers were for this fight: 17 connects a round, 40 thrown, for a landed percentage of 44%. Again, if people could say Floyd suddenly did something different between rounds 1 and 3 that would show he had made an adjustment and had figured Shane out or some such then I could see that but he didnt. He was doing the same things, it was Shane who dropped off the face of the map. Indeed Mayweather was fighting at the same measured pace he always fights, throwing the same amount of punches, landing the same, etc etc. All that says is that Shane wasnt able to sustain his output after 2:30 of the second round.

  7. #127
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    But Gato

    Prime Shane has Floyd in THAT scenario, he CLEARLY is going to take advantage of the situation MUCH better than he did. The Shane we saw, when he Truly had Floyd hurt, the second time in the 2nd round, he was ineffective and then stopped throwing. NOT becuase of anything Floyd WAS doing. But becuase of what THIS version of Shane was Unable to do.

    SHane KO 2 Floyd. Does it sound farfetched? Maybe. But Prime Mosley takes care of business better agaisnt a wounded foe, much better than what we saw THIS Shane do.

    Analogy here:

    Thomas Hearns KO 1 or KO 2 Mike McCallum.

    Pretty absurd sounding on the surface right?

    But, if it was the Hearns from the Duran bout agianst McCallum who was hurt very badly in the 1st round agiasnt a very raw and inexperienced Julian Jackson, Tommy finishing the job doesn't sound so silly.

    ANd replace Hearns with "lost his Luster and Shine" Donald Curry after the Cobra nearly dropped McCallum in the second round of their bout and Tommy finishing THAT job isn't all that outrageous either.

    (Hell, prior to June 15th 1984 if you told me Tommy Hearns would do to Duran what he DID do to Duran I'd have told you to get ahold of yourself as well!)

    I think all that is being said here about Mosley and Mayweather, is that had that been a PRIME Mosley who had Floyd hurt in the second round.......Mayweather is in a whole lot of friggen trouble and getting stopped isn't that much of a stretch.

    Hawk

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    Could it be for those that refuse to give mayweather the credit he truly deserves, could it be that he simply backed Mosley up, had Mosley constantly in a uncomfortable position taking punishment, eating leather. Hell he was getting battered all-around the ring. Could it be that Mayweather's style , pace, prophetic statement that Mosley can't do anythiing cuz he has no jab, and defense while walking him had just as much to do with the outcome as Mosley's age?

    Is it simply too hard to give Mayweather his just due? I wonder if he fights and slaughters pacman what will his detractors say then.

    Funny not too long ago we where giving Mosley praise for backing up Margerito, but I see no one making reference of this when the tables are turned. Could it be because it's Mayweather who turned the tables?

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    I think Floyd's defensive and recuperative powers would prevent that happening, provided he got into that situation in the first place. Just my opinion. Shane was an overwhelming finisher, not a methodical, pin-point finisher like a Ray Leonard.

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    Ultimately, this may have been more a coincidental Chicken AND the Egg scenario.

    From rds 2 to 3 there was simply not enough time for either guy to react to the other and assume the altered roles that they did. I think Mayweather simply stepped it up a notch and adopted a relatively more aggressive role for better or worse WITHOUT necessarily knowing that Shane was as gassed as he was. A genuine credit to Mayweather, as I see it.

    On the other hand, the instant round 3 began, there was no time for Mosley to suddenly drop tools in reaction to Mayweather's modified strategy election. It just so happened that Shane was gassed and couldn't do much of anything ANYWAY. Shortly after rd 3 began I saw nothing to make SSM as impotent as he was and was screaming for Shane to simply let his hands go as he did in the previous two rds. There was simply nothing there and it wasn't as a result of anything Mayweather did.

    However, I do think that the increasing degree of Mayweather's domination and how much he was willing to step it up even more through the following rds did, imo, naturally have a reasonable correlation to how obviously and how quickly SSM was fading.

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    Quote Originally Posted by bodyblow
    How? He never upped his punch output, and indeed Mosley was gassed late in the second after trying a fairly half hearted attack to finish Floyd. Its funny that because Floyd was moving forward and side to side as opposed to backwards he is somehow suddenly an offensive monster according to some. His punch output was right at where it has always been. In his five fights at WW he lands an average of 17 punches a round, throws an average of 37, and connects at 46%. Guess what his numbers were for this fight: 17 connects a round, 40 thrown, for a landed percentage of 44%. Again, if people could say Floyd suddenly did something different between rounds 1 and 3 that would show he had made an adjustment and had figured Shane out or some such then I could see that but he didnt. He was doing the same things, it was Shane who dropped off the face of the map. Indeed Mayweather was fighting at the same measured pace he always fights, throwing the same amount of punches, landing the same, etc etc. All that says is that Shane wasnt able to sustain his output after 2:30 of the second round.
    I am saying he came out round 3 much more aggressively and offensively, than usual, especially more than he was round 2 or 3.

    Seems like there is simple a refusal to admit Floyd is simply a great fighter. Now we are hearing that a fighter that did not go down, has never actually went down cleanly, who held on (like your supposed too) regrouped, then actually showed true championship heart, a jaw and how he could deal with adversity... We are hearing that he would have gotten stopped had it been a younger Mosley. WOW. , based on what?

    What does Mayweather have to do. True he beat a old Mosley. Ok, this alone does not make him all- time. But his entire body of work is pretty damm good. Once he pounds pacman into submission, is he gonna have to beat a heavyweight. Remember he Mayweather has moved up too.

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    Could see this tactic

    coming a mile away.

    Problem is, there were those of us who said well before the bout ever came off that Mayweather was going to win this fight pretty easily, BECAUSE the version of Mosley that was fighting would be a 38 year old who hadn't fought in over 16 months and had not done particularly well with a stylist in, well, since the first de la Hoya bout in 2000.

    THAT ended up happening.

    What happened in the 2nd round, with Shane hurting Floyd, was completely UNEXPECTED, at least to me. The fact that Shane was unable to finish or sustain the job, spoke more about what Shane no longer is (and has not been for some time now) than anything that Floyd has supposedly "proven".

    I'm with Surf here. My "Gut Check" bar is set a little bit higher.

    Hawk

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    Pd99. I think Mayweather reacted, as he has in previous fights and shut mosley ( an older version - true)down. Round 3 he came out directly after Mosley and there was nothing Mosley Imo could do about it.

    Too bad this fight didn't years ago. I think Mayweather tried repeatedly to get this fight.

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    To quote MYSELF:

    02-05-2010, 10:30 AM #59
    hawk5ins

    I would love for

    --------------------------------

    Evan to be wrong here.

    But he ain't.

    He's spot on.

    Save yourself some money folks and if you want to view Mosley being slow on pulling the trigger, pop in either Winky Wright bout.

    Difference being, THOSE two relatively dull bouts will seem like Boza Chacon in comparison to what happens May 1st.

    I wasn't thrilled with Mosley being MOSLEY agianst Berto (although I thought if he was even remotely close to what he was agianst AM, the Berto bout would be a breeze.) and I have gone on record multiple times saying I thought Manny Mosley would have been vastly more entertaining than Manny Mayweather would be, due to styles and willingness to FIGHT, by both fighters. (I would pick Manny to beat both Shane and Floyd btw.). But this Matchup TODAY, is going to suck.

    Mosley Mayweather 5 years ago would have been a very good bout. If it took place when Shane was still a Lightweight and Floyd was at 130, it would have been even better. And in both cases, I would take Shane.

    But not at 38 years old and having been idle for 16 months.

    He'll never catch up to Floyd. Floyd will minimize the action and exchanges and we'll be bored out of our skulls.

    That is, IF the bout does come off. Still riding my 75% theory.

    Hawk


    Note(s):

    * Obviously my point about Manny and Mosley being a better bout was CONTINGENT on Mosley showing what he had left in either the Berto or Mayweather bout. Obviously he has nothing left and I think Manny would have steamrolled Shane.

    * Round 2 of Mayweather Mosley was more entertaining than any round of Wright Mosley. After that though, not so much

    * And my point about Shane never catching up to Floyd....Well Shane did in the 2nd round....twice. But then was unable to do anything about it.

    * And NO, Floyd did not move as much as I expected him to. But then again, Shane didn't do anything after the first 2 mins and 30 seconds of the 2nd round with which Floyd would NEED to move away.

    * Ring Mag had a catchy little line to describe Pacquiao and Clottey: "Clottey about 2 chain links away from being a Heavy bag"

    After the 2:30 mark of round 2, that pretty much describes Shane Mosley agaisnt Floyd Mayweather.

    Hawk

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10



    Sugar Shane Mosely looks fat...

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    Kiki - Never allow yourself to be photographed from below the jaw line - after a certain age, it can be none too flattering.

    There are varying degrees of gut checks and a boxer can only prove himself against the very demands made of him at any given time. Beyond that, it is mere speculation as to how that boxer might react under greater duress.

    For instance, Liston survived abbreviated yet yet intense gut checks in both Williams' fights but they weren't the be all and end all tests of Liston's true limits.

    Mosley's right hand bombs were arguably the greatest test of Mayweather's chin to date. A chin is a chin but it is also bouyed by the sheer will to stay upright. In the instances in question, Mayweather showed plenty of willl to remain in the fight. How he chose to fight thereafter was just as important - he certainly didn't run but instead chose to stay right in front of Mosley. There was no Camacho or Jones backpedalling act.

    For a fighter who doesn't normally get hit that often, eventually having to take a bomb at the wrong end of their career might result in disaster. I'm of the belief that a fighter who does takes his fair share of leather during his career is perhaps increasingly better conditioned (mentally and physically) for same as time goes by (see Ali).

    All in all, I think Mayweather's gut was pretty well checked with successful results but of course, there are a number of other levels to pass through before one could even consider comparing him to the likes of Ali, Leonard, etc.

    One last thing, it's true - many discounted Mosley straight up and down. An assessment not without merit. However, and I'm not saying it was the case for this fight, there seems to be a growing trend to make overly critical, pre emptive strikes on opposition - in order to unfairly take from a forecasted victory.

    Manny Pac has suffered same. Pre fight, DLH was simply too much for him. Post fight, DLH was absolutely washed up. An opinion AFTER that fact. But Manny did as much to DLH as one could expected from a GREAT fighter. However, after spectacularly rolling Hatton, detractors were getting wise to the game. Bagging the opposition AFTER the fact makes you look like a goose. Better to unduly bag the opposition before the fight, particularly if you forecast a win for for the guy you're not particularly enamoured with.

    By the time he was about to face Cotto, there was a good number of fans suggesting that Cotto was damaged goods and if Pac did in fact beat him, well, it wouldn't necessarily be all that. Pac was beginning to be placed in a neer do well situation NO matter what he ahieved.
    Last edited by PD99; 05-03-2010 at 09:26 PM.

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    And, further to the theme of pre emptive strikes - which are not always disingenuous - some opposition can be fairly critiqued BEFORE the fact.

    Of course a lead in for me to play Devil's Advocate, I now might ask, relative to their natural size, which achievement would be deemed the GREATER - The naturally bigger Mayweather defeating Pacquiao or the naturally smaller Pacquiao defeating Mayweather in equal measure? Personally, I would view a Pac victory as that much more impressive but there would be obvious nip and tuck required in that assessment depending upon how impressively either man won.

    If Mayweather were to KO Pac in say 2-3 rds (dfficult to to suggest that even in theory) that would, for argument's sake, exceed a close decision victory for Pac's on the other sde of the ledger.

    Keeping it simple, with degree of victory being equal on either side, just to be clear, I repeat, my nod goes to Pac.

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    Quote Originally Posted by wpink
    Could it be for those that refuse to give mayweather the credit he truly deserves, could it be that he simply backed Mosley up, had Mosley constantly in a uncomfortable position taking punishment, eating leather. Hell he was getting battered all-around the ring. Could it be that Mayweather's style , pace, prophetic statement that Mosley can't do anythiing cuz he has no jab, and defense while walking him had just as much to do with the outcome as Mosley's age?

    Is it simply too hard to give Mayweather his just due? I wonder if he fights and slaughters pacman what will his detractors say then.

    Funny not too long ago we where giving Mosley praise for backing up Margerito, but I see no one making reference of this when the tables are turned. Could it be because it's Mayweather who turned the tables?
    Or maybe its because we have no dues to give? Mayweather gave an impressive performance. But we can't gloss over the fact it was still against a significantly past it shane mosely. Mayweather hasn't fought and performed against the elite welters at the zenith of their power that would give him the dues he thinks he deserves. I think hes great, i think he could... but he HASNT.

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    I'm with Cliff in saying that the punch Mosely landed in the second round likely doesn't even land on a young PBF.

    If we are talking about a 25yr old Mosely against a 33 year old PBF, ok, MAYBE he finishes the job in the 2nd round. But this isn't what we are talking about here.
    Prime to prime, I just cannot see Mosely winning this fight.

    Mosely's best fight was outpointing a just-past-the-peak DLH 10 years ago.
    It was a close fight & far from a shut out.
    Shane's a nice guy & good boxer but let's not get too crazy here.

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    Hawk, I talked about how Mosley is similar to Holyfield previously, and the 3rd fight of he and Bowe is exactly what this looked like to me.

    As for a prime Mosley, it's a completely different ballgame. Prime Mosley never relied on one punch power, he was actually a good counter-puncher, had a great jab and had a good punch output. He also had quite a bit of lateral movement (people tend to forget that now, similar to how they forget how much lateral movement Tito had in his prime Welter days), had great head movement and was far quicker than even now.

    I'm not sure a younger Mayweather would avoid that shot by Mosley. The difference between a younger Mayweather, was he used his feet more, but I'm not sure the reflexes are much different. On slow replay, he was watching shots that hit him coming, his awareness and reflexes are still there IMO, the only difference is he would be out of the killzone more as a younger fighter.

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    Quote Originally Posted by diggity
    I'm with Cliff in saying that the punch Mosely landed in the second round likely doesn't even land on a young PBF.
    That may well be so. On the other hand, the Mosley who threw that punch was hardly a young, or prime, Mosley.

    This fight tells us very little about a fight between Mosley and Mayweather, prime to prime, at welterweight. It tells us even less about a fight between the two at lower weights.

    The question is, How good was the version of Mosley who fought Mayweather? I was never sold on that version of Mosley. Yes, Mosley looked good against Margarito, and I delighted in watching that fight. But how good was Margarito? We really don't know: the issue of the wraps has made it impossible to reach any conclusion about Margarito's talent. I do recall watching Santos versus Margarito a number of years ago and thinking that Margarito was gaining ground before the fight was stopped. But I also think that Margarito was behind on points when the fight was stopped--and he was fighting a guy who should never be considered for the Hall of Fame.

    Mosley was no world-beater against Cotto. Although I was rooting for Mosley in both fights against Wright, Wright clearly won both of those fights. I was rooting for Mosley in his fights against Vargas, and Mosley won both of those fights--but who would think that that version of Vargas was anything but a shell? (And, of course, who would argue that Vargas deserves to be included in the top 20 at 154--or the top 50 at 147?)

    I think that PBF may well be the best fighter these days, pound for pound. (I could make a case for Pacquiao, but I recently talked to a smart guy who thinks otherwise. He knows more than I do, and I ain't arguing with him.) I rooted for Mayweather against Gatti (heresy!), Judah (of course!), and Hatton (meh). I rooted for Mayweather because I thought that he was and always had been a better fighter than those three. In regard to Mosley, I don't believe that Mayweather has always been the better fighter, especially not at 147. But I was not at all surprised that, on May 1, 2010, Mayweather was the better fighter. Heck, on May 1, 2010, I'd pick Mayweather above Ali.

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    Quote Originally Posted by diggity
    I'm with Cliff in saying that the punch Mosely landed in the second round likely doesn't even land on a young PBF.

    If we are talking about a 25yr old Mosely against a 33 year old PBF, ok, MAYBE he finishes the job in the 2nd round. But this isn't what we are talking about here.
    Prime to prime, I just cannot see Mosely winning this fight.

    Mosely's best fight was outpointing a just-past-the-peak DLH 10 years ago.
    It was a close fight & far from a shut out.
    Shane's a nice guy & good boxer but let's not get too crazy here.

    LOL so now DLH was just past his peak in 2000??? He was 27 and outside of a controversial decision loss to Trinidad in a fight that he DOMINATED for 8 or 9 rounds had never been defeated and went on to be a factor in both the WW and JMW divisions for several years before giving up a fight to Floyd on a ONE ROUND SWING 7 years later.

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    I always thought that was the best DLH. He fought with fire and determination that we didn't always see from him. He gave it everything he had as far as I could tell.



    Anyway, I think Floyd deserves more credit for taking the fight than winning it.

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    Dig

    Zab Judah was able to land cleanly on Mayweather (147).

    Demarcus Corely was able to land cleanly on Mayweather (140).

    Jose Luis Castillo was able to land cleanly on Mayweather (135).

    Why wouldn't a Prime Mosley be able to land cleanly on a Prime Mayweather?

    I say there is no reason to think he doesn't.

    And were a prime Shane to hit and hurt a prime Floyd in the manner we saw Saturday, with his speed and power, if he has Floyd in that same condition, I say it is very likely that he finishes the job.

    Something he couldn't do Sat.

    Hawk

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    Tit for tat, yeah. I've seen those fights too hawk, I know. DLH was able to land too don't forget. But none of those guys landed a shot like Mosely did other than Corely which cmon, it was a total fluke & a product of PBF toying with him. And Zab IMO is a tad faster than both Mosely & PBF.

    All I'm really saying is that typically those kind of shots in PBF's career don't land. I just doubt a punch like that lands on the athletic PBF who battered the hell out of Corrales. Not saying it absolutely couldn't, sure it could. If you give me a shitload of attempts, maybe I could land a punch on PBF (ok, maybe not but just trying to illustrate a point). Mosely was a pretty fast & explosive fighter and I originally thought Shane would beat Mayweather at their respective bests. But after this fight, when I look at them both in retrospect & re-remembering Shane, I've simply changed my mind about how close a fight at their primes would have been. My memories of Shane are just a lot fonder than how I think he should really be remembered. That's all.

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    Quote Originally Posted by bodyblow
    LOL so now DLH was just past his peak in 2000??? He was 27 and outside of a controversial decision loss to Trinidad in a fight that he DOMINATED for 8 or 9 rounds had never been defeated and went on to be a factor in both the WW and JMW divisions for several years before giving up a fight to Floyd on a ONE ROUND SWING 7 years later.
    REEEELAAAAX! Like its the first time anyone suggested DLH was already on the wrong side of the cusp at that point. I should have used the word "arguably" there to better illustrate the point I was trying to make.

    Quote Originally Posted by prodigious1
    I always thought that was the best DLH. He fought with fire and determination that we didn't always see from him. He gave it everything he had as far as I could tell.
    Agreed prod & it could have very well been.

  27. #147
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    THink you

    should stick with your original thoughts on a matchup between the two in thier primes.

    It seems you are allowing what we saw Sat to cloud things.

    I didn't actually forget ODLH landing on Floyd. I left him out on purpose as it seemed you were arguing for how Floyd was as a fighter in younger years at lower weights.

    At 154, I assumed the Oscar fight would be tossed out.

    Lesser fighters at lower weights landed on Floyd solidly. With that, there seems no reason to think that a superior, harder hitting and faster fighter in Shane, would also not be able to land as well. ANd if he did, as solidly as he did in the 2nd on Sat, Floyd's in for a world of hurt.

    You brought up Corralles and 130.....Well Shane never fought at that weight, whihc probably was Floyd's best weight. IMO he has never been as consistantly impressive agiasnt as high calibre opposition as he was at that weight.

    And yet, it's not as though Hernandez, Manfredy and Corralles are wart free either.

    If Mosley and Mayweather were to have met at lower weights than 147, then 135 would have been the best bet.

    Based on what we saw from Mosley at 135 and what we saw from Floyd at 135, I CLEARLY give Shane the advantage.

    140, Shane never really fought in. But we have limited (in number and quality) opposition that Floyd faced at that weight to judge Mayweather on as well. Given Shane was killing himself to make 135, 140 would have been a more comfortable weight for him to face Floyd at. And seeing what he had at 147, I think we can theorize what he would have been at that weight as well.

    147, I think beating Oscar, was the best we ever saw of Shane. And IMO it was the best we ever saw of Oscar as well. I do think it's a stretch to suggest Oscar was on the slide. Especially when you consider his next 4 bouts, Oscar looked absolutely spectacular in.

    Give me THAT Shane at 147 over Floyd. And Give me THAT Oscar as well, over Floyd.

    ANd EITHER one of those two have Floyd in the trouble he was in in the 2nd round, I favor both of them being able to finish the job, either right there, or doing enough damage that Mayweather is unable to recover and recoup and is stopped later on.

    Hawk

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    Quote Originally Posted by diggity
    Tit for tat, yeah. I've seen those fights too hawk, I know. DLH was able to land too don't forget. But none of those guys landed a shot like Mosely did other than Corely which cmon, it was a total fluke & a product of PBF toying with him. And Zab IMO is a tad faster than both Mosely & PBF.

    All I'm really saying is that typically those kind of shots in PBF's career don't land. I just doubt a punch like that lands on the athletic PBF who battered the hell out of Corrales. Not saying it absolutely couldn't, sure it could. If you give me a shitload of attempts, maybe I could land a punch on PBF (ok, maybe not but just trying to illustrate a point). Mosely was a pretty fast & explosive fighter and I originally thought Shane would beat Mayweather at their respective bests. But after this fight, when I look at them both in retrospect & re-remembering Shane, I've simply changed my mind about how close a fight at their primes would have been. My memories of Shane are just a lot fonder than how I think he should really be remembered. That's all.
    Agreed 100

  29. #149
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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    This is ridiculous EVERY fighter gets clocked. Ali, Robinson, Leonard, Duran, Hearns, EVERYBODY. Shane has fast hands & in the first 2 rounds he had energy, So he caught Floyd with a shot. So what???

    The only thing that matters is how you TAKE the shot & Floyd handled it fine.

    All this kvetching, parsing & what ifs is just plain weak. Your guy lost. It happens. Deal with it. Get over it.

    Making sniveling excuses for Shane is just pathetic. The visceral (not totally unfounded) hatred for Floyd is just so over the top. Shane lost & that's all there is to it. & anybody with ANY common sense going into the fight would have KNOWN it was going to go down that way.

    Instead the mass animus for Floyd completely blinded everybody to the fact that Shane has been shot for YEARS yet this somehow still got turned into a pseudo mega-fight.

    Again, ridiculous...

    GorDoom

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    Re: Mayweather-Mosely Results & Discussion 5/1/10

    Hawk, the fight didn't "cloud" anything. I simply re-evaluated what I thought & remembered how I felt about Shane in the days post-Forrest - forgetting the past 2 years or so.
    It's just what I think, not a thesis.

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