Jerry Quarry vs Ken Norton

[pendleton23]

I never got to see Jerry Quarry box.I knew the name and always associated it with Ali first comeback bout.I just saw Quarry against Norton on espn classic.First off what a tremendous bout.I mean toe to toe action.And second off now I know what the older posters on this form meant that if Quarry fought in todays heavyweights he would be champ.
I can't believe the puinshment he took.Unbelievable.There is no doubt in my mind that if matched with todays heavyweight champs he would be victories.And I don't care if he had a 500lb weight disadvantage there is no way they could beat him.I had no idea Quarry was that good.

[PeteLeo]

And remember, this was a Quarry well into his boxing dotage, as well as one who had had only about a week to prepare for the match. Unfortunately, Jerry paid dearly for his toughness later on. PeteLeo.

[Jeri Curl aka Overhand Right]

Try check out his first fight with Smokin Joe Frazier.

That effort that night would have bumped off most of the subsequent champions we have had..

[StingerKarl]

Not to take anything away from Kenny who was superb that night; but Jerry entered that fight with very bad and sore hands. He hurt both of them in the Scrapiron Johnson fight, they were bad enough to begin with, and he couldn't put all of his mustard into his shots that night against Ken.
Karl

[naf2003]

Quarry was overweight for the Norton fight. A well conditioned Quarry would have a good chance of beating Norton.

[Mr E]

If both men were at their peaks, I'd pick Quarry.

[Juan C Ayllon]

Hey,

Maybe a year and a half, two, or longer ago, former CBZ poster, Rick Farris, pointed out that he witnessed Jerry Quarry knockout Ken Norton in sparring before Ali-Norton I, as I recall. He also mentioned that one light heavyweight, Bossman Jones (?) kayoed Norton in sparring.

I also witnessed perrenial contender Scott LeDoux get Kenny in very serious trouble at the end of their fight. Kenny's back was turned facing out on the ropes when the final bell rang. He was truly "saved by the bell."

Personally, I favor an in-shape, peaked Quarry to stop Ken Norton.

Regards,



Juan C. Ayllon

[brutu]

If it wasnt for that clash of heads which I think caused that really bad cut on Quarry,and if Quarry
had not have been so available to hit,I think Ken Norton would have collaped from exhaustion around round 8.
Also in Ken Norton's autobiography he makes no mention of ever having sparred with Jerry Quarry.
He just says they didnt like one another and that Quarry
was the only boxer he wanted to punish in the ring.
(although possibly also Boone Kirkman too,when you read the book).
Also notice how huge Norton looked compared to Quarry in that fight,yet how much smaller Ken Norton looked compared to George Foreman in 1973,it looked like Norton was one of those big ballooons of Thanksgiving parade and the air was going out of him,second by second.
George Foreman looked like a Tyrannosaurus and Norton looked like his duck-billed dinosaur prey.

[Hagler04]

brutu-Norton to me was not showing signs of exhaustion . . he displayed great stamina throughout his career . . .what makes you think he would have collapsed from exhaustion?

[Juan C Ayllon]

Hey guys,

Not that this means anything, but simply omitting something--especially something distasteful--from ones biography does not mean it didn't happen.

Regards,


Juan C. Ayllon

[Chuck1052]

I would go with Jerry Quarry over Ken Norton,
who was very vulnerable to good fighters who
could punch. Look at Norton's bouts with
Earnie Shavers, George Foreman, and Gerry
Cooney.

- Chuck Johnston

[brutu]

I saw the fight re-played again on ESPN classic after many years.
Actually it was a clash of heads in round two I think that caused swelling over Quarry's eye,but a punch in the next round opened a cut over the other eye of Quarry.
The fight was not as one sided as one might read in a article,the first three rounds were competive.
Also even the commenter said Norton looked exhasited in round 4 I think,he was arm tired of punching Jerry Quarry.
Did you see that vicious upercut that Norton landed?
BTW Did you see that creep in the audience behind Jerry Quarry's wife giving the camera the finger?

[gregbeyer]

quarry may have had bad hands for the norton fight but what i think cost him was over confidence. jerry once knocked norton cold in sparring and when they met jerry expected a walk over rout....thats what he got too...in reverse.

the memory i have of that fight is jerry getting so badly chopped up that his management asked photogs to please not take pictures of the dejected quarry.

a peak quarry would surely do well today but a peak quarry could have done better then too. too many times he entered the arena in less than top condition. he should have been in a lot better shape for the second frazier fight but there again having seen joe lose to foremen he came in over confident and under trained...big mistake, because that night he should have taken joe who was on the way down while jerry was on a hot streak.
greg

[Dragnet 69]

Quarry also took the fight on short notice and wasn't in top shape. TIP

[Chuck1052]

I should add that I would go with Jerry Quarry
when he was at his peak over Ken Norton.
Of course, Norton beat Quarry when the
latter was past his peak.

I also believe that both Joe Frazier and Ron
Lyle would have beaten Norton. As noted
before on a previous post, Norton didn't
do well against sluggers. In fact, Norton
was made for someone like Frazier who
punched well to both the body and the
head with his powerful left hooks.

- Chuck Johnston
- Chuck Johnston

[HEGrant]

A Quarry / Norton match up featuring a prime Quarry would have really been an interesting fight to determine just how good Gerry really was. He was clearly not up to Ali and Frazier. He was better than the Shavers, the Lyle's and the Fosters. Norton was a lot closer to the upper class than anyone Gerry actually beat. Norton froze up against huge punchers but against anyone less, he was hell. It would have been a tough fight but I might lean to Gerry catching him at some point.

[kenmore3233]

I remember Norton vs. Quarry very well because that was the night I became a boxing addict. I was just a junior high school kid at the time.

As you'll recall, Ali vs. Wepner took place that same night. I think it was ABC that showed both fights on national television about a week later.

Anyway, I pick a prime Norton over a prime Quarry. Kenny was too big, too fast, too strong and too dynamic for Jerry, even if both were fighting their best.

As for the real Norton-Quarry fight, Norton won big, although Quarry did put up a good fight.

Norton won the first two rounds handily, but Quarry stormed back to win the third. Jerry had Norton pinned on the ropes for most of that round, and he went for broke trying unsuccessfully for a kayo.

Norton came back to win round four, and then in round five Kenny was battering Quarry at will when the fight was stopped.

Norton did not seem fatigued to me at any point in the fight.

In Quarry's defense, it must be pointed out that he was not in the best of shape. He took the fight on short notice, weighing 208 lbs, which was about 6 or 7 pounds higher than his optimal weight.

An interesting sidenote to their bout is that after the fight, Norton supposedly invited Quarry's wife to his hotel room. Norton is alleged to have said: "I showed your husband what a man I am, and now I'll show you what a man I am".

Can you believe that...Norton hitting up on the defeated opponent's wife?

As for Quarry having kayoed Norton in sparring years earlier, I find that hard to believe. I have never heard that before despite having read every boxing magazine printed between 1973 and 1981.

If there was any truth to the Quarry kayoing Norton in sparring story, it would have been vocalized by Quarry himself, and no doubt it would have been repeated often in the magazines and newspapers.

[StingerKarl]

I agree with you about Frazier, Chuck.
But; I think Kenny would have beaten Lyle on points.
He was just a better fighter than Ron, IMO.
Ron was not a Hitter in the Shavers mold-he was a tough plodding clubber who came to fight and could take a good shot.
I always thought Ken would have jabbed him and beat him on points-and I like and admire Ron.
Just my thoughts-and I have no quarrel with your picking Ron as I loved to watch him fight, and he's a really nice guy.
Karl

[TKO11]

I think it was Rick Farris that gave the tidbit about Jerry KOing Norton in sparring, and routinely kicking his ass when not KOing him. I'll take Rick's word on it much faster than any of the boxing mags.

[four oclock]

...my wife and I were out to dinner Friday with friends when I noticed fights on the lounge TV. Must have been a Quarry night as I saw the Norton fight followed by Frazier 2. Not a very good cross section of Jerry at his best I must say. I had forgotten that big hook Joe smashed Jerry with that took wind completely out of Quarry's sails. What a shot! Not to mention another pathetic performance by an ex-champ trying to play referee.

I've been re-thinking a Quarry/Norton prime scrap. I've always thought that Jerry's punch was a tad overrated in that virtually all his knockouts were the result of sustained punishment (forget Shavers, a strange fight that also featured a rather green Earnie). Now I'm believing that perhaps Quarry didn't possess a big enough wallop to put Ken in retreat mode from the get go. Perhaps a UD or late cuts stoppage for Norton.

IMO a much more intriging scrap is the afformentioned Norton/Lyle which strangely never took place. On another board about a year ago this mythical matchup was hotly debated with most of the "experts" split 50-50 on who might prevail.
My $0.02

[HEGrant]

Lyle...too big a puncher and fast a starter.

[robertk]

agreed.

And he'd have kenny backing up which is always going to be a key event in a norton fight. And a nasty left hook which is the shot to throw against a crabshell defense. Norton was/is, simply put, about 40% as effective of a fighter backing up vs. going forwards and he is a guy that has to be on his top form to beat the guy. When kenny got backed up he was the loser every time. He even looked terrible against mediocre guys like cobb and ledoux because of this.

I used to live in denver in the mid-70's and the lyle camp couldn't make the fight. They took on every other guy out there and lyle talks about his effectiveness sparring w/ norton in that Facing Ali book.

[four oclock]

I was one the the ones who picked Norton a while back.
I agree it could easily go either way but IMO Norton was simply a more polished fighter who I feel would outwork Lyle.
Granted a Lyle bomb could land on Kenny and mark the beginning of a short night but how about a Norton bomb landing on Lyle. (I remember Quarry saying how anxious he was before the start of his scrap with Lyle only to see Lyle's knees buckle in the first round from a left hook and I would rate Jerry and Kenny's power as roughly equal.

I still must argue that this would be a very interesting bout.

[StingerKarl]

I spoke with Tina Quarry yesterday afternoon (Jerry's last wife) and she is upset that ESPN is only showing Jerry's losses as they have his major wins in their boxing library as well.
Karl

[rocky111]

This bout proved nothing. Gerry Quarry was past it, out of shape (look at his body) and no power left. Norton was at this peak. Like Joe Louis against Marciano, the pop was gone from Jerrys punch. This matchup proved nothing. Ken Norton did was he was supposed to do. Could Jerry defeat Ken Norton if both were at their best? Im sure he could have done very well. The Quarry who fought Norton had nothing, but there were nites that Quarry had plenty enough to handle the best Ken Norton.

[brutu]

Norton in his autobiography says that was the best fight of his proffesional career,"The Perfect Fight".
Even in the first rounds the commenters said Quarry looked stale and his hook wasnt as sharp.
BTW What is the Facing Ali book you mentioned?
Is that a anthology written by various opponents of Ali?
That sounds interesting.
In Earnie Shavers book,he says its scary that most of his opponents he faced in his career were either dead or incarcerated.

[brutu]

Yes,the past week I saw three Jerry Quarry fights on ESPN classic,
the first fight with Ali in 1970 last Saturday during the Ali marathon,
and last Friday they showed in a block,
Norton vrs Quarry
and Frazier vrs Quarry 2.
The only other Quarry fights I have seen on ESPN during the past several years,
is Frazier vrs Quarry 1,
and Ali vrs Quarry 2.

[four oclock]

...not to invade a thread but this thought just dawned on me.
If Lyle hadn't dropped a post-Ali brain dead Foreman twice (who almost killed Ron a couple of minutes later) the Lyle rep vs. major champs/contenders is virtually ZERO....nothing.

I'm more convinced now then ever that Kenny Norton takes out Lyle Pvs.P

...but of course I could be wrong :\

[HEGrant]

I can't explain Lyle's fight against Ali..Ali did absolutely nothing for the first ten rounds...yu almost have to see it to believe it...I mean nothing...Lyle was extremely cautious,almost terrorified of being in the ring with the legend...it was onbious that he feared punching himself out like Foreman did...however, Ali caught him with a decent shot in the 11th, nothing great and the man simply froze like he was caught by Joe Louis...Ali flurried a bit and the ref stops the fight...considering the fight he put up against Foreman, I simply never could understand that performance. It went far beyond styles. It seemed the man was terrorfied of fighting Ali for the title.

Lyle showed tremendous power and heart against Foreman. He came off the deck and stopped Shavers in a great performance. Shavers hit him with a murderous left hook, something you rarely saw from the right hand crazy Shavers.

Lyle did not have a great record against the big names but as we all know to the point of nausia, styles make fights and he would have been very tough and dangerous for Norton.

[four oclock]

Couldn't agree more with your comments.
I remember the Ali/Lyle scrap well, May of 75 with a 10 round non-title Galindez-Elston on the undercard. As that was my party period I recall being "under the influence" that evening which made the action that much more vivid.
You're right, Lyle was too concerned with punching himself out and acted just plain weird for most of the fight.
Strange that with all his inactivity that night he appeared to be gasping for air at the end as if he was totally spent.