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Thread: jay cutler:goat or misunderstood

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    jay cutler:goat or misunderstood

    jay cutler: the bear's goat or misunderstood hurt player left out to dry by coaches & fans.... you decide--->>>

    http://content.usatoday.com/communit...-knee-injury/1

    Jay Cutler under attack for leaving Bears' loss with knee injury
    07:36 PMYahoo! BuzzShare
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    By Sean Leahy, USA TODAY
    149 Comments

    The Chicago Bears defended QB Jay Cutler on Sunday after he came under withering criticism from fans, analysts and even fellow players for having left an NFC title game loss to the Green Bay Packers with a knee injury.

    Cutler exited the game, with the Bears trailing 14-0, early in the third quarter. He remained on the sidelines, spending some of the remainder of the game looking sullen in a seat on the bench and some of it standing on the sideline.Jay Cutler

    Third-stringer Caleb Hanie rallied the Bears in a game they would eventually lose 21-14, but some fans took out their frustration on Cutler by burning his jersey in the parking lots outside Soldier Field.

    Fellow NFL players questioned Cutler's toughness on Twitter during the game, and ESPN analyst and former Super Bowl-winning QB Trent Dilfer called him out after the game.

    "You can play this position (QB) hurt," Dilfer said on ESPN. "Some of us have."

    Cutler said he hurt his knee late in the second quarter and said he was unable to play effectively after trying just after halftime. (Video of Cutler's remarks below.)

    "We gave it a go in that first series," Cutler said, "but couldn't plant and throw, so ..."

    Players such as Jaguars RB Maurice Jones-Drew and Cardinals DT Darnell Dockett suggested on Twitter that Cutler had let his teammates down.

    But Bears LB Brian Urlacher rejected those who would question Cutler.

    "Jay was hurt," Urlacher said.. "I don't question his toughness. He's one of the toughest guys on our he's tough as hell. He's one of the toughest guys on our football team. He doesn't bitch, he doesn't complain when he gets hit, he goes out there and plays his ass off every Sunday, practices every day.
    "So, no, we don't question his toughness."

    Bears coach Lovie Smith said there was no hesitation to pull Cutler after officials determined his knee was too sore to play. He appeared to grow agitated by repeated questions about Cutler's status.

    "He hurt his knee, and he was out," Smith said. "There's nothing else for me to tell you on that."

    The Packers earned a berth in the Super Bowl with the 21-14 win. Before exiting, Cutler was 6-for-14 for 80 yards with an INT. He was sacked twice.

    Cutler could not identify on which play he was hurt, and said he hoped surgery would not be needed.

    He said it was a "lonely feeling" sitting on the bench in the second half while first Todd Collins and then Hanie replaced him.

    Asked if he was disappointed when the decision to lift him was made, Cutler said, "I knew that it was probably better that I didn't."

    On Twitter, Jones-Drew and Dockett were among several players who commented on Cutler's status.

    Said Jones-Drew: "Hey I think the urban meyer rule is effect right now... When the going gets tough........QUIT.. ... All I'm saying is that he can finish the game on a hurt knee... I played the whole season on one..."

    Said Dockett: "If I'm on chicago team jay cutler has to wait till me and the team shower get dressed and leave before he comes in the locker room!"
    Cutler said he had "no comment" when asked about the criticism of his toughness after the game.

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    Got love this.

    Question:

    Was his play affecting his team? ANd did anyone see things changing the way he was playing out there?

    The only answer anyone can honestly give is NO.

    I thought he tried like hell and his struggles were painfully obvious.

    I didn't see a quit. I saw a player who was obviously hurting, HURTING his team out there on the field.

    A change HAD to be made.

    So if Cutler refuses to be taken out, then d-bags like Dilfer can go on about how selfish Cutler is by hurting his team by playing at the level he was playing at.

    Sheesh.

    I'll give Cutler this: He didn't hide behind a shaded protective shield like someone else did a few years back.

    Hawk

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    Re: Got love this.

    Quote Originally Posted by hawk5ins
    Question:

    Was his play affecting his team? ANd did anyone see things changing the way he was playing out there?

    The only answer anyone can honestly give is NO.

    I thought he tried like hell and his struggles were painfully obvious.

    I didn't see a quit. I saw a player who was obviously hurting, HURTING his team out there on the field.

    A change HAD to be made.

    So if Cutler refuses to be taken out, then d-bags like Dilfer can go on about how selfish Cutler is by hurting his team by playing at the level he was playing at.

    Sheesh.

    I'll give Cutler this: He didn't hide behind a shaded protective shield like someone else did a few years back.

    Hawk
    good points...

    I find it amazing how just in one day this guy has become the blown-up pinata for the nfl. I mean not only is the media all over this contrived story, but other ex & current players are piling on the guy. all w/o knowing all the facts.

    you bring out a good point about cutler not hiding. that in a round about unfair way is what is hurting him. cutler's problem is, hes a straight-up, wear it on the sleeve guy. he doesnt put on phony rah rah postures. hes kind of a surly dude & he doesnt hide it.

    thus the media & others read that look on the sidelines as apathy.

    the truth was the team told him not to go in. my quess that decision was partly made b/c the coaches conviently wanted a change b/c cutler was playing like crap. I really feel like its the coaches more then anything who have left him out to dry. they should go to the media w/ a definitive statement of what really happened. good or bad to clarify if he really was whining or was called to sit out by coaches and docs.

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    Re: jay cutler:goat or misunderstood

    I dont think Cutler is the Greatness of all time, but I dont hold sitting out against him, perhaps in his mind, he might have better the team with a 100 percent back up QB, than Cutler.

    Cutler was not doing so hot in the game any way. So perhaps the backup might do better. Yes I think a lot of Bear fans are upset over Cutler and the lost(The youtube videos of shirt burnings lol)

    But he got hurt, he didnt think he can play 100 percent, and perhaps help the team out for setting out.

    There is playing hurt, and playing hurt that could hurt your health, or the chance of winning the game for the team. I dont expect Cutler to be a Smith of the cowboys, with a broken shoulder rushing against the Gaints and winning the game almost by himself. No one should expect Cutler to do that. I think people are too fast on the gun here.

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    I also

    am not a Cutler fan, nor do I think he's on a level with any of the elites.

    Maybe he gets there one day. Maybe not.

    This guy has taken a pounding in the two years he's been with Chicago.

    Either the result of a bad offensive line in which he's been pummelled or through poor play, in which he's gotten an INT bug that he could not shake.

    Yet I have never seen this kid quit. Never.

    Not when Dallas manhandled him in the first quarter of their game this year, which Cutler and the Bears were able to turn things around in the 2nd quarter.

    Not when the Giants sacked him 7 times in a loss and Cutler only managed 42 yards passing.

    Cutler against the Packers was obviously hurt and he was hurting his team. His play WAS abysmal. What was his passer rating? In the 30's right? He was missing recievers left and right. He was 6-14 and had a pick.

    Nothing was working.

    I honestly don't blame the coaches. They saw what was happening and they made a decision to pull him. IMO it was the correct decision. ANd when they saw Collins was not working out, they went with Hanie and it nearly worked.

    I echo the whole "rah rah" aspect here. Becuase Jay ISN'T that way, in a moment where it probably would have enhanced his image, he didn't fake it and become "that guy".

    Sorry. THis was simply an easy target for a few guys who wanted the opportunity to take a shot at Cutler.

    Hope he comes back and sticks it right down their throat, and when the Schlereth's and Dil-hole's of the world want to have Cutler on thier particular shows to chat with them, Jay tells them to go take a flying leap.

    Nice. This whole thing has probably TURNED me into a Cutler backer, if not fan.

    Can't understand why the obvious wasn't seen in all of this.

    Hawk

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    Re: jay cutler:goat or misunderstood

    I'm more confused at how any coaching staff that has been conducting practices all year could conclude Collins should be above Hanie on the depth chart.

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    Only seen

    a handful of Bears games this season and last, but based on the NFC title game...........It is BAFFLING indeed Sharks.

    OY!

    Hawk

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    Re: I also

    Quote Originally Posted by hawk5ins
    am not a Cutler fan, nor do I think he's on a level with any of the elites.

    Maybe he gets there one day. Maybe not.

    This guy has taken a pounding in the two years he's been with Chicago.

    Either the result of a bad offensive line in which he's been pummelled or through poor play, in which he's gotten an INT bug that he could not shake.

    Yet I have never seen this kid quit. Never.

    Not when Dallas manhandled him in the first quarter of their game this year, which Cutler and the Bears were able to turn things around in the 2nd quarter.

    Not when the Giants sacked him 7 times in a loss and Cutler only managed 42 yards passing.

    Cutler against the Packers was obviously hurt and he was hurting his team. His play WAS abysmal. What was his passer rating? In the 30's right? He was missing recievers left and right. He was 6-14 and had a pick.

    Nothing was working.

    I honestly don't blame the coaches. They saw what was happening and they made a decision to pull him. IMO it was the correct decision. ANd when they saw Collins was not working out, they went with Hanie and it nearly worked.

    I echo the whole "rah rah" aspect here. Becuase Jay ISN'T that way, in a moment where it probably would have enhanced his image, he didn't fake it and become "that guy".

    Sorry. THis was simply an easy target for a few guys who wanted the opportunity to take a shot at Cutler.

    Hope he comes back and sticks it right down their throat, and when the Schlereth's and Dil-hole's of the world want to have Cutler on thier particular shows to chat with them, Jay tells them to go take a flying leap.

    Nice. This whole thing has probably TURNED me into a Cutler backer, if not fan.

    Can't understand why the obvious wasn't seen in all of this.

    Hawk
    Good points. I remember during the game after seeing some his absolutely awful throws that he must have some sort of injury, and turns out he did.

    Plus the guy has taken an absolute BEATING the last two years in Chicago, and never quit once . . and now he has a knee injury and he's mr. 'no mas'??

    STFU Dilfer, and the rest of the City of Chicago (some of the worst fair-weather fans in all of sports)

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    Re: jay cutler:goat or misunderstood

    What disturbs me the most about this is that I have to side with Michael Irvin. That pains me to no end because I tend to avoid standing on the same side of the fence with people-who I believe-have deplorable character.

    Anyway, Irvin said he didn't know if Cutler was hurt but that watching guys like Philip Rivers play and play well, when obviously hurt, makes everyone assume that all should and can do this. There are those who remember Byron Leftwich being carried up the field by his offensive lineman when he was at Marshall...and Jay can't play in the conference championship?

    Is this a fair comparison? No.

    Like Hawk said, though, Cutler wasn't playing well, either. He was a detriment to the team, as he has been when healthy at times. But he looked gimpy, off balance and obviously hurting to me. For the record, Hawk, I don't see much difference in the very thinly-veiled LT2 attack.

    Also, I literally laughed out loud at what Deion Sanders said. He went on and on about how he would have to be carried off of the field, in it to win it and a bunch of other blah-blah-blah. I thought to myself "Why? It's not like you were ever going to make a tackle anyway."

    As good a cover corner as I have ever seen but he never got hurt because when there was physical contact to be had, Prime Time was the Invisible Man. And he's going to talk about toughness? Please.

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    Absolutely

    Rivers got my attention with that game against the Patriots.

    And even MORESO becuase Tomlinson went to the sidelines and sat there with his "mask" on.

    It was an EXTREMELY gutsy showing by Rivers and he has to be applauded for that effort and willingness to play when Tomlinson would not.

    Here are a few differences though with LaDanian and Cutler.

    Tomlinson, carried the ball 2 times for virutally no yardage and recieved one pass. He was gone before the end of the first quarter. Turner and Sproles did all the heavy lifting that game while Tomlinson sat behind his mask.

    Cutler, who did play AWFUL the entire time he played, did at least make it into the 3rd quarter. He gave it what he had, it simply was not only NOT good enough, he was in fact hurting his team.

    I suspect that had he demanded not to come out and CONTINUED to kill his team with his play, Cutler gets excoriated for not thinking "team first". That he was selfish and his ego got in the way.

    Now, to a point about Rivers performance against the Patriots in the "ACL" game.

    Rivers played COURAGEOUSLY. But he did not play WELL. He was serviceable.

    The Chargers scored no TD's in that game and only had 4 Field Goals in a game Tom Brady TRIED to give away with the THREE INT's he threw that game.

    But SD never could capitalize, becuase Rivers, try as he might, could really not do a whole lot.

    He threw for 211 yards on 19 completions, with 2 INT's himself.

    We all Recall the Guttiness and the fact that the final score was 21-12, it all leaves us with the memory of Rivers nearly pulling it out.

    Well again, Most of the opportunities cames on The defense forcing turnovers and Brady's multiple INT's. But the Offense, could NOT take advantage and turn those TO's in to TD's.

    Reason? Rivers, for all of his gritty display, could Not do what he could have done were he healthy.

    Makes for a nice story. But the tales that came out of that game, are not necessarily accurate.

    But Micheal Irvin would never let the facts get in the way of a good story.

    Hawk

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    Here's a very

    informative phone interview on SI.Com, with a Dr. Tom Hackett who explains just what a grade 2 MCL Sprain actually is.

    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/foo...fl/?eref=sinav

    Hawk
    Last edited by hawk5ins; 01-26-2011 at 11:14 AM.

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    Re: jay cutler:goat or misunderstood

    You guys are confusing the facts: Rivers did not tear up his knee, gut it out and keep playing. He hurt his knee the week before in the first half and CAME OUT of that game and did not return. After a week of intense therapy he played in the Patriot game.

    Totally different situation and not at all as it's being portrayed in the media and by fans. As to Cutler, I'm not a fan at all but this criticism is bullshit. The guy was the most sacked QB this year. I saw him get killed by the Giants and he didn't flinch. He's missed one game his whole career and to top it off this guy has full blown Type 1 diabetes and has to get shot with insulin 8-12 times a game.

    He's not tough? Jesus, he's a diabetic taking hard shots to the kidneys and people are questioning his courage? Yes he sure seems to be an asshole but I don't think his courage should ever be in question.

    EMF

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    Re: jay cutler:goat or misunderstood

    My point was that we can all toss examples out there of someone else who did play despite...Me personally, I don't doubt Cutler was hurt for several reasons. Track record, what I saw on the field last week and how Urlacher and Lovie bristled at the questions. Defending a team mate is one thing, but those two seemed offended.

    But, I can understand while not agree with those on the other side. I saw Youngblood play in the Super Bowl on a broken leg...I saw Namath play with tears streaming down his face on the sidelines...the Emmit Smith shulder show...saw it.

    I think Cutler is getting a raw deal here but I understand it. I also think, in his case, because he has gone so far out of his was to be a surly ass, that it's exponentially enhanced. Again, not fair, but it is what it is.

    IMHO, because of his personality, I think this is all hilarious. I tend to think that most NFL players are probably jerks to some degree, they've been the BMOC their entire lives. A guy who doesn't even make the slightest effort...he's GOT to be, down to the core. So this happening to a Jay Cutler, Keyshawn Johnson, Warren Sapp...boo hoo hoo.

    Hawk: LT2 is a halfback. A halfback with a groin tear shouldn't even bother to get on the plane. The Leftwich example I cited earlier, well, you can't do that with a halfback.

    I would even go so far as to say compare Emmitt's performance against the Giants with LT2's no-show against the Patriots. That's the same to me as comparing Tyrell Biggs separated shoulder and winning to Wilfred Benitez' breaking his ankle and quitting.

    The first example in both scenarios is courage, while the latter two are necessities.

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    Understand where you are coming from

    Husk.

    I absolutely think the Jerk factor is the driving force in all of this.

    But unfortunately, the Dilholes and Schleprock's of the ex-football fraternity cum talking heads, are actually ME into a Cutler backer.

    THier gusto to "stick it to Cutler" has me feeling sympathy and the need to back Jay Cutler.

    Can't ever have imagined that happening.

    Now IS Jay Cutler as tough or as gutsy as a Jack Youngblood was? I'd say no.

    But it is also rather unrealistic to expect EVERY player to have that much inner fire.

    Plus I do think there is a point here re Cutler being hurt DURING a game, and a player coming into a game hurt, but also all shot up with cortizone to numb the pain.

    Honestly though, it actually irks me that I tend to keep taking these players like Cutler under my wing in hopes that they put it in the face of the critics.

    I'd prefer to be on the bandwagon to trash guys like this. But somehow, it never works that way for me.

    Hawk

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    Understand where you are coming from

    Husk.

    I absolutely think the Jerk factor is the driving force in all of this.

    But unfortunately, the Dilholes and Schleprock's of the ex-football fraternity cum talking heads, are actually ME into a Cutler backer.

    THier gusto to "stick it to Cutler" has me feeling sympathy and the need to back Jay Cutler.

    Can't ever have imagined that happening.

    Now IS Jay Cutler as tough or as gutsy as a Jack Youngblood was? I'd say no.

    But it is also rather unrealistic to expect EVERY player to have that much inner fire.

    Plus I do think there is a point here re Cutler being hurt DURING a game, and a player coming into a game hurt, but also all shot up with cortizone to numb the pain.

    Honestly though, it actually irks me that I tend to keep taking these players like Cutler under my wing in hopes that they put it in the face of the critics.

    I'd prefer to be on the bandwagon to trash guys like this. But somehow, it never works that way for me.

    Hawk

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    Re: jay cutler:goat or misunderstood

    If you have Showtime, you have to see Phill Simms weigh in on this. He was hot. Livid hot. He'd do well to substitute for you. I was more with Cris Collinsworth, but seeing Phill's fire, I'm closer to your team than I was.

    I agree with the expectations part. I really do. Certain guys, with their style of play, I might think would not gut it out. Cutler doesn't fit that mold. One of the perks I wish I didn't have from living in NC is that I get a Vanderbilt/Wake Forest/East Carolina game at noon every Saturday. Let me tell you something, I saw Cutler in at least 20 games in college and if you think the Giants beat on him? Good Lord, that kid should have transferred and sued the Commodores.

    He's tough as nails. He's also someone I wouldn't want to spend 30 seconds with. I'll always respect his talent and his guts but as to him getting bushwacked by the fraternity...oh well. I'd say he had it coming with how he presents himself.

    EDIT: Mark Schlereth is a very bright guy who I think is paid to stir the pot. In a sense, he reminds me of Jim Lampley because everything that comes out of his mouth is passionate. Dilfer? I don't even have a comment for him. He doesn't add anything to anything for me.
    Last edited by Husker; 01-30-2011 at 07:17 PM.

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    Husk

    Simms was livid hot at Cutler or vitriol that was spewed out about Cutler?

    Unfortunately, no I don't have Showtime.

    Hawk

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    Re: jay cutler:goat or misunderstood

    Phill was pissed at the backlash. He started by saying he was glad they were filming on Wedenesday because if it had been on Monday, he'd have gone off. He was shaking a little. Seriously.

    If there is anyone in Jay's corner, it starts with Phill Simms.

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    And apparently

    Charles Barkley.

    I did Like what he had to say. His only criticism of Cutler was if he was going to be on the sidelines following being pulled, he should have been in Hanie's ear offering up advice and encouragement.

    Legit critique.

    Hawk

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    Re: And apparently

    Quote Originally Posted by hawk5ins
    Charles Barkley.

    I did Like what he had to say. His only criticism of Cutler was if he was going to be on the sidelines following being pulled, he should have been in Hanie's ear offering up advice and encouragement.

    Legit critique.

    Hawk
    i dont buy that. barkley is once again spouting off before thinking.

    why would or should cutler do this when its never been in his character to do so. If he had, it wouldve come off contrived & phoney. something his teammates wouldve felt much more uneasy about.

    sure it would be better if cutler was a team rah rah communicator in that juncture, but it has never been that way. again, much worse to be a fraud.

    furthermore, its not like hes the only starting qb from the past who wasnt a back patting rah rah man. anyone, remember the cold & aloof relationship of joe montana towards young? hey, for all the flack that farve has gotten of late, he handled the pressure from his underling (rodgers) w/ much more grace & support then joe did.

    or how about ken stabler, not exactly mr gladhand when things werent going well around him. even mr all american, staubach, could be as icey as his head coach, when it came to dealing w/ danny white.

    the bottomline is, his teammates still havent turned on him. furthermore, they've even come foward in support. both of wh/ should be strong signs to people who understand team dynamics & lockerrms that cutler wasnt tanking it.

    its funny coming from barkley b/c not only was he more surly then cutler, he was much more petulant when things didnt go his way.
    Last edited by HandToMouth; 01-31-2011 at 07:05 PM.

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    I agree

    that isn't Cutler's modus operendi. ANd if we DID see that from Cutler, it would seem out of place.

    But still think it is a legit criticism. Much more tangible at least that the "no heart" nonsense.

    Would have loved to have heard Simms's comments.

    And it annoys me to no end that these guys never have to follow up or through on their comments. But then, who is going to call them on it? IE, "Schleprock, did you hear what Phil Simms had to say about your recent comments?"

    Nope. It gets buried.

    Hawk

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