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Thread: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    Victor Ortiz vows to 'teach' Floyd Mayweather Jr.

    Boxers trade pointed comments in advance of bout at Las Vegas' MGM Grand on Saturday, and Ortiz's trainer has something to say too.

    By Lance Pugmire

    September 14, 2011
    Reporting from Las Vegas — The most modest man at the podium made the boldest statement Wednesday.

    Danny Garcia, a soda truck driver who also trains world welterweight champion Victor Ortiz, turned to multimillionaire Floyd Mayweather Jr. and made a simple, passionate plea that will resonate until the boxers square off at the MGM Grand on Saturday night.

    "Floyd, at least for this fight, fight a good clean fight for the people," Garcia said as he stared down at Mayweather, who was seated at a news conference dais. "We all know how you fight.

    "Don't put up your elbow, don't turn your back. That tells me you're scared of fighting."

    Strong words from a working-class man whose morning delivery route includes stops in Ventura, Oxnard and Camarillo.

    It wasn't Mayweather's turn to speak, but as he showed HBO cameras during training camp, when he threw his father out of his gym in an expletive-filled tirade, he doesn't have much patience in debate.

    "Yeah, I am scared of fighting," answered Mayweather, mocking Garcia's accusation. "That's why I've been dominating here for 16 years. I'm the one doing the [pay-per-view] numbers. I'm not worried about you. You're the trainer. Let your fighter fight."

    Ortiz, 24, who claimed the World Boxing Council title with a stirring exchange-of-knockdowns battle with Andre Berto in April, took up his trainer's cause.

    "You have 41 [victories], but none of those 41 were against me," said the Ventura boxer, who has a record of 29-2-2 with 22 knockouts. "I sense some nervousness. I am the current WBC champion. I'm going to teach you what it's like to have that one [loss]."

    Mayweather, 34, whose 41-0 record includes 25 knockouts, cautioned his younger foe — a 51/2-1 underdog at the MGM Resorts' Race and Sports Book — telling Ortiz to stay "classy."

    Ortiz responded with a dig at Mayweather's involvement in a felony domestic violence case in which the mother of his three children was allegedly a victim.

    "Oh, we're talking about class here? I'm going to put you on your [rear]," Ortiz said.

    When it was Mayweather's turn, he expressed surprise that the Ortiz camp had turned scornful.

    "The trainer says I'm a dirty fighter. Well, it's a dirty sport," Mayweather said. "It's the hurt business. How can it be clean?"

    He added, "Don't worry about me backpedaling. I'll come straight ahead. The fight's not going the distance. When I hit you and hurt you, don't grab me. I'm going to finish you off."

    Mayweather also claimed Ortiz's sad story of being abandoned in his youth by his father is "not true" — citing Internet talk as his source of information. Mayweather said he's grown tired of Ortiz's repeating, "Dude, I grew up with nothing."

    There was another message: Welcome to big-time boxing, kid.

    "It didn't bother me. I'm a tree stump, man," Ortiz said afterward. "You can say whatever you want. I know when you do something well, everyone's your friend, and when you hit the floor, everyone forgets you.

    "It's going to be a sad moment for Floyd Saturday night."

    lance.pugmire@latimes.com

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    if it hasn't been posted:

    Floyd Mayweather Jr. remains a heavy favorite to dethrone WBC welterweight champion Victor Ortiz on Saturday night. International sportsbooks are listing Mayweather at -800 while Ortiz backers can get +500.

    WBC junior middleweight Saul “Canelo” Alvarez is an even bigger favorite to dispatch Alfonso Gomez. Canelo is -1600 and Gomez is +800.

    Three division world champion Erik Morales is a heavy favorite to become the first Mexican to win a world title in four weight divisions. Morales is -700 against Pablo Cesar Cano +450.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    Ortiz camp should protest the use of Cortez. He is a Vegas ref and Floyd is from Vegas, not to mention that Cortez is one of the worst "top" refs out there. How he gets these elite assignments is beyond me. On 24-7, when the Ortiz people were criticizing Floyd's use of elbows against Hatton and saying the ref let him get away with it, guess who the ref was? ... Joe Cortez. You don't think Cortez knows that it was the Ortiz camp who criticized him? This is just another set up for a bad smell associated with boxing. Cortez will either have it out for Ortiz or will try to bend over backwards the other way to show he isn't biased, which isn't fair to Mayweather. If he had any honor, he would reject the assignment.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    Floyd Mayweather Jr. pours salt in Victor Ortiz's wounds
    September 15, 2011 |

    Floyd Mayweather Jr. has launched mental warfare against his 10-years-younger Saturday night opponent Victor Ortiz, inviting Ortiz's ex-trainer Robert Garcia and Ventura County rival world champion Brandon Rios to watch near ringside.

    "I saw Garcia at a fight at state line [Primm, Nev.] not too long ago. He asked to come to my next fight, and I said that'd be great," Mayweather said. "I'm a man of my word."

    Especially when it's this irritating to the opposition's camp.

    Not only did Ortiz drop Garcia as his trainer after a 2007 bout, claiming the trainer was "mean," he hired Garcia's brother, Danny, as his new trainer.

    That created such a severe falling out in the Garcia family that Robert and Danny are not on speaking terms. It doesn't help that their backyards in Oxnard butt up against each other.

    Mayweather claimed Wednesday that Ortiz's explanation that he was abandoned by his father at the age of 12 was "not true," counting Robert Garcia and Internet reports as his "research."
    Ortiz insists his father was abusive and walked away after Ortiz's mother quit parenting.

    Contacted by telephone, Robert Garcia told The Times he's heard from a former neighbor of the Ortiz family that Ortiz's "dad never left him, was always there for him."

    Garcia said he couldn't remember Ortiz's father ever checking in by telephone or any other means after Garcia and his father effectively took over guardianship of Ortiz at age 16, with the then-amateur boxer relocating from Garden City, Kan., to Oxnard.

    On Wednesday, Ortiz gave Mayweather's claims little attention, though Danny Garcia announced he "loves his brother" and expressed hope for a reunion someday soon. Robert Garcia said he agreed with that sentiment but first wanted Danny "to admit" he was wrong by not alerting the Garcia family to his intentions to replace Robert as Ortiz's trainer.

    "He knows why I don't want to talk to him," Robert Garcia said. "I had brought Danny in to help me train fighters and get a piece of every guy. Then we find out by surprise that Victor wants to go somewhere else, and that Danny is training him. If he wanted to do that in the first place, all he had to do was tell us. Fine, go make some money.

    "Finding out without him telling us, it's ugly now. I've learned when there's money involved, it can change people. I just want Danny to tell me why he did it.

    Mayweather was reportedly contemplating asking Robert Garcia and his star fighter Rios to accompany him into the ring with Ortiz, but Robert Garcia said he "wouldn't be comfortable" doing so. He said he did want to attend the fight, however, and was pleased to receive an invitation from Mayweather advisor Leonard Ellerbe on Wednesday.

    "I think Mayweather wins, and I'm not the only one," Robert Garcia said. "Victor does hit hard, and he has power, but I believe Floyd will pick him apart.

    'Victor is weak-minded. If Floyd starts landing [punches] on him, Victor will lose it. I know he will. It happened when I had him in the amateurs. It happened [two years ago] against [Marcos] Maidana."

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    Quote Originally Posted by JaKob View Post
    I just went back and watched mayweather vs hatton. I knew Mayweather looked uncomfortable, but upon rewatching it he looked far more uncomfortable than i remembered. Hatton wasn't a solid welter and didn't have the durability required to impose that gameplan but he gave a decent account of himself whilst it lasted. Hatton didn't make the mistake the likes of mosely and judah did. He didn't linger at the end of mayweathers range getting tentative and looking for an opening. He come all the way forward smothering, ripping to the body and maintaining good intensity. Mayweather's relatively conservative output and pot-shotting style left him vunerable to Hattons tactics.

    I definately favour Mayweather. That being said i think the bigger and stronger Ortiz can make this reasonably competitive if he is consistently aggressive and letting his hands go even in the face of mayweathers inevitable counter-punching success. The moment he hesistates to come forward and surrenders the momentum floyd will light him up in a big way.
    Interesting Jacob, I haven't watched that Hatton V Mayweather fight since live and I don't remember him looking uncomfortable at all, but I respect your knowledge and always enjoy reading your opinion so I'll take your word.

    Your second pargraph basically sums it up, the minute Ortiz becomes mesmerized (ala BHOP opponents) Floyd will light him up in a big way.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    These little games floyd plays. It may indeed be promotion and mere hype, but it's ugly and sure is getting tiresome.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    Although the fact that Ortiz feels he can tell his trainer when he wants a day off has me slightly put off, believe it or not, I think he may be able to win on Saturday night. As JaKob pointed out, I totally agree that Hatton was roughing up Floyd and making him VERY uncomfortable early on. Baby Floyd even purposely ducked his head out of the ring to avoid the bull rush rather than move or fight his way out. That is, until, Joe Cortez stopped letting Hatton fight the way he wanted to. I am not going to debate whether what Cortez did was right or wrong under the rules. Some refs let fighters like Hatton get rough (as in Hatton-Tszyu), some don't. But, the fact remains that when a fighter like Hatton or Castillo roughed him up and pressured him, he didn't like it. To Floyd's credit, he was able to catch an onrushing Hatton running in (like a novice) with his hands down and knock him out. However, as we saw in the Pacquio fight knocking out Hatton ain't exactly like knocking out Tex Cobb. But, I really believe Floyd looks a little scared in this one. He is acting like even more of an immature baby than usual. His body is starting to lose musculature, and his face is starting to look sunken. Ortiz is definitely going to be the stronger man and the harder puncher Saturday night. If he can apply the same type of pressure game he put on Berto, Floyd will be very uncomfortable. And, although Ortiz is still a bit green, his resume has some better names on it than most up and comers do theses days. (I said these days, mind you. I am not comparing his resume to any that had real talent). I think Ortiz is as ready as he is going to be, and if his chin doesn't fail him, I think he will start to rough up Floyd by the halfway point and have Floyd running scared by the final bell. When that final bell is sounded, Ortiz will have earned seven rounds by his activity, and Floyd will have squeaked out 5 close boring rounds based on his reputation.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    As a sidenote regarding saturday's card: Although I have always liked Erik Morales as a fighter, the fact that they are calling his fight against some nobody an actual Title fight on Saturday is not only a sham.... It is just plain DISGUSTING!

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    I think this will be a close fight, and not at all surprised will I be if Ortiz wins, or at least wins
    and does not get the nod. This is close: Floyd is getting the judges nod.

    I will bet 7-5 rds for Floyd; nearly all rds will be competitive and close.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    The questions i have regarding ortiz is how he will fare in the face of Floyd's counter punching. How strong is he mentally. Floyd isn't a big puncher relatively speaking. What he does have is great accuracy, timing, and placement. He will potshot and occasionally really sit down on a shot and tag his man coming in with perfect timing. Im just not sure whether ortiz will become flustered and tentative. I know he took big shots from berto, but floyd will sting him with hard counterpunches he really doesn't see coming and this poses a different psychological challenge. He needs to accept the fact he is going to get hit, take risks, and keep moving forward.
    Last edited by JaKob; 09-16-2011 at 10:24 AM.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    I agree with you 100% JaKob. But if Ortiz can stay mentally strong, he will give Floyd Hell.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    Quote Originally Posted by JaKob View Post
    The questions i have regarding ortiz is how he will fare in the face of Floyd's counter punching. How strong is he mentally. Floyd isn't a big puncher relatively speaking. What he does have is great accuracy, timing, and placement. He will potshot and occasionally really sit down on a shot and tag his man coming in with perfect timing. Im just not sure whether ortiz will become flustered and tentative. I know he took big shots from berto, but floyd will sting him with hard counterpunches he really doesn't see coming and this poses a different psychological challenge. He needs to accept the fact he is going to get hit, take risks, and keep moving forward.

    I think a shot is a shot is a shot. He took Berto's, and really, if he saw Berto's first, he surely would have defended
    agaisnt them. So, the whole cliche of "getting KO'd with the shot he didn't see," well, of course he
    didn't see it. If he did, he would have got away from it.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    I have a feeling that this -- like, say, Haye-Klitschko -- is going to be one of those fights that everyone hopes will be better than it has any chance of being. Floyd can be given problems, but not by straight-ahead, medium-power punchers with weak chins. As much as I'd like to see Floyd put on his butt and beaten, I don't think Victor is the guy to do it.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    Quote Originally Posted by don1234 View Post
    if it hasn't been posted:

    Floyd Mayweather Jr. remains a heavy favorite to dethrone WBC welterweight champion Victor Ortiz on Saturday night. International sportsbooks are listing Mayweather at -800 while Ortiz backers can get +500.

    WBC junior middleweight Saul “Canelo” Alvarez is an even bigger favorite to dispatch Alfonso Gomez. Canelo is -1600 and Gomez is +800.

    Three division world champion Erik Morales is a heavy favorite to become the first Mexican to win a world title in four weight divisions. Morales is -700 against Pablo Cesar Cano +450.
    I sure hope he does not screw this one up like Mayweather v Hatton, or Francisco V Soto, or that one bout where he left the guy laying on the canvas unattended. I hope once he is done with his "I'm fair but I'm foim," charade in mid ring, he LETS THEM FIGHT. He took Hatton's whole fight away on the inside breaking them with endless gibberish delivered in unintelligible rapid cadence. Very unfair and poor choice of refereeing styles for this fight.

    I hope it goes well for Joe, but more so I wish the Commissions would stop appointing their pet referees despite how many Mercante Junior type fuck ups they cause. How does it work now? The more you screw up the more you get assigned?

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    Quote Originally Posted by apollack View Post
    Ortiz camp should protest the use of Cortez. He is a Vegas ref and Floyd is from Vegas, not to mention that Cortez is one of the worst "top" refs out there. How he gets these elite assignments is beyond me. On 24-7, when the Ortiz people were criticizing Floyd's use of elbows against Hatton and saying the ref let him get away with it, guess who the ref was? ... Joe Cortez. You don't think Cortez knows that it was the Ortiz camp who criticized him? This is just another set up for a bad smell associated with boxing. Cortez will either have it out for Ortiz or will try to bend over backwards the other way to show he isn't biased, which isn't fair to Mayweather. If he had any honor, he would reject the assignment.

    I sure hope he does not screw this one up like Mayweather v Hatton, or Francisco V Soto, or that one bout where he left the guy laying on the canvas unattended. I hope once he is done with his "I'm fair but I'm foim," charade in mid ring, he LETS THEM FIGHT. He took Hatton's whole fight away on the inside breaking them with endless gibberish delivered in unintelligible rapid cadence. Very unfair and poor choice of refereeing styles for this fight.

    I hope it goes well for Joe, but more so I wish the Commissions would stop appointing their pet referees despite how many Mercante Junior type fuck ups they cause. How does it work now? The more you screw up the more you get assigned?

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    Sorry, I replied to the wrong post first.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    Dont really know whats going on here, but check out Mayweathers tricep, looks kind of flabby,



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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    Is there a link to a video on their weigh in yet or any photos of them weighing in? I can't believe Ortiz let him put his hands on his neck.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    Shit!!, Time Warner is asking $64.99 + fees & tax's (HD) for this fight, up theirs, I ain't buy, no way Jose....

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    $64.99? Jesus Christ, that is so damn unfair in this economy to ask that. It should be $49.99 tops if that. Triple play cable packages are going up constantly from $239 a month to $278 in just a short time for the same thing, same channels.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    Quote Originally Posted by prototypeofamodernmadman View Post
    Dont really know whats going on here, but check out Mayweathers tricep, looks kind of flabby,


    Yea Mayweather looks like he is aging. His face and body dont look the same. He is simply looking older.

    Another thing I notice is that Mayweather doesnt look as confident as he usually does. Mayweather is usually in control of the pre fight promotions by dogging his opponents in such disrespectful ways that his opponents either look bothered or beat down by his constant barrage of insults. Ortiz is a different animal. He looks so supremley confident and relaxed that I think it has taken Mayweather out of his comfort zone. I just saw a clip where Floyd was jabbering a mile a minute in Ortiz's ear during a stare down and Ortiz simply laughed and whispered in his ear,"we are going to have a nice dance". Mayweather wouldnt look in his eyes as he kept on with his ghetto jabber. The fact that Mayweather lost his cool and put his hands on Ortiz while Ortiz looks to have just kept his cool tells me a lot. I am actually starting to think that Mayweather is a bit rattled.

    I am still going with Mayweather but this kid Ortiz I think has a great shot. 34 years of age with 5 five fights in five years isnt going to help Mayweather. Little Floyd hasnt fought a YOUNG, hungry fighter in years.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    Quote Originally Posted by JaKob View Post
    The questions i have regarding ortiz is how he will fare in the face of Floyd's counter punching. How strong is he mentally. Floyd isn't a big puncher relatively speaking. What he does have is great accuracy, timing, and placement. He will potshot and occasionally really sit down on a shot and tag his man coming in with perfect timing. Im just not sure whether ortiz will become flustered and tentative. I know he took big shots from berto, but floyd will sting him with hard counterpunches he really doesn't see coming and this poses a different psychological challenge. He needs to accept the fact he is going to get hit, take risks, and keep moving forward.
    I also agree. I feel Victor is going to fold like a lawn chair. PBF knows every trick in the book. Victor will be getting a painful boxing lesson.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdqSCn6QtC4

    There is the weight in.

    That was hectic!!! Some seriously hyped up people at the weight in and it was very high energy between the fighters. This is going to be an awesome card.

    Floyd will eat Ortiz up though and everybody is going to say the same afterwards, "Mayweather took on a bum", "Everybody knew this outcome, Mayweather just pot shotted his way to victory". Simply put, Mayweather is on a different level to Ortiz and is going to give him a boxing clinic which for any fan of the sweet science, is beautiful to watch. I am really looking forward to this fight and I truly missed Mayweather in his temporary retirement, personality aside, he is a guy who does what few before him have been able to do as far as his counter-punching ability.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    Within the confines of the weigh in ceremony, I think Floyd was more jangled than Ortiz, if Ortiz was jangled at all (seemed fine).

    Imo, pressing his forefinger into Oritz's neck and then putting his hand to his throat was pushing the boundaries.

    However, the fact that Ortiz simply stood his ground without raising a hand in return left Floyd to hang out and dry as an unsettled, wannabe thug. Without reciprocation, Floyd didn't know what to do next and looked a little bit lost thereafter.

    Possibly just ALL show from both sides.

    Any which way, I doubt Floyd will alow any emotion to impact on his performanc come fight time.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    I thought the fact Ortiz had that WBC belt and was holding it upto a cheering crowd, and Floyd didn't have anything in his hands, really got to Floyd. Which is why he raced in to turn Ortiz around and face off so furiously.

    In the end though, I think any of these tactics will get to Ortiz far more than Floyd. Floyd is calm as ice in the ring, Ortiz on the other hand is still definately battling his demonds, hence the staredown 'hard front' he is always putting on. In the official 'face off' with Max, he could barely get a sentence out he was so concerned with maintaining his 'tough man glare'.
    Last edited by The Welterweight Epitome; 09-17-2011 at 02:27 AM.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    Quote Originally Posted by kikibalt View Post
    'Victor is weak-minded. If Floyd starts landing [punches] on him, Victor will lose it. I know he will. It happened when I had him in the amateurs. It happened [two years ago] against [Marcos] Maidana."
    Low blow by Roberto Garcia right before the fight.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    Quote Originally Posted by The Welterweight Epitome View Post
    I thought the fact Ortiz had that WBC belt and was holding it upto a cheering crowd, and Floyd didn't have anything in his hands, really got to Floyd. Which is why he raced in to turn Ortiz around and face off so furiously.

    In the end though, I think any of these tactics will get to Ortiz far more than Floyd. Floyd is calm as ice in the ring, Ortiz on the other hand is still definately battling his demonds, hence the staredown 'hard front' he is always putting on. In the official 'face off' with Max, he could barely get a sentence out he was so concerned with maintaining his 'tough man glare'.
    Yes, I agree that Ortiz's "front" is perhaps more a desired projection than genuine disposition. Perhaps even a necessary self affirmation also.

    Certainly, a "tree stump" is more believable simply being what it is rather than constantly professing itself to be so.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    The Ledgers

    Floyd Mayweather
    Age:
    34
    Titles: Lineal World Welterweight Champion (2010-Present, 1st Attempted Defense)
    Previous Titles: Lineal/WBC Jr. Lightweight (1998-2002, 8 Defenses); Lineal/Ring/WBC Lightweight (2002-04, 3 Defenses); WBC Jr. Welterweight (2005); IBF Welterweight (2006); Lineal/Ring/WBC Welterweight (2006-08, 1 Defense); WBC Jr. Middleweight (2007)
    Height: 5’8
    Weight: 146.5 lbs.
    Average Weight – Last Five Fights: 147 lbs.
    Hails from: Grand Rapids, Michigan
    Record: 41-0, 25 KO
    Record in Major Title Fights: 19-0, 9 KO including lineal title contests
    Current/Former World Champions/Titlists Defeated: 15 (Genaro Hernandez, Gregorio Vargas, Diego Corrales, Carlos Hernandez, Jesus Chavez, Jose Luis Castillo, DeMarcus Corley, Arturo Gatti, Sharmba Mitchell, Zab Judah, Carlos Baldomir, Oscar De La Hoya, Ricky Hatton, Juan Manuel Marquez, Shane Mosley)

    Vs.

    Victor Ortiz 

    Age:
    24
    Title/Previous Titles: WBC Welterweight (2011-Present, 1st Attempted Defense)
    Height: 5’9
    Weight: 147 lbs.

    Average Weight – Last Five Fights: 142.55 lbs. 

    Hails from: Oxnard, California
    Record: 29-2-2, 22 KO
    BoxingScene Rank: #2
    Record in Major Title Fights: 1-0 (1-1, 1 KOBY including interim title fights)
    Current/Former World Champions/Titlists Defeated: 5 (Alfred Kotey, Carlos Maussa, Nate Campbell, Vivian Harris, Andre Berto)
    Last edited by Crold1; 09-17-2011 at 10:06 AM.

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    Carlos Maussa is missing as a former world champion Ortiz defeated (KO1).

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    Re: Mayweather-Ortiz, Sept 17th

    INteresting fight because of Floyd's age and inactivity ... however he is the much stronger fighter mentally .... I se him busting up Ortiz and possibly having his first stoppage since Hatton ...

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