Archie Moore vs. Jerry Quarry at cruiserweight

[newpoppop]

I think Jerry outworks Moore, and wins by late stoppage, or UD.

[Every Mother's Fear]

Big fan of both but let's see: Quarry, very good heavyweight, cruiser by today's standards. Good all around skills but a bleeder and could be very inconsistent. Moore: All time great HOFer. Holds all time Ko record. Yes , lost by Ko a few times but to who? All time HOFers like Charles, Marciano, Patterson and Ali. If he could not only survive but over come Durelle in one of the greatest brawls of all time at over the age of 40; I think this is a no brainer.

Moore by UD or TKO.

EMF

[mrbig1]

I would pick Moore Also. On the other hand Quarry at his best was damn good. My Question is can Moore's chin hold up over 12 or 15 hard rounds. I know Moore is a all time great, But Quarry first put on a pair of gloves at age 3. Let me add that Quarry IMO fought in the toughest era in HW history. The reason why I would pick Moore is that he is cool under fire. Quarry biggest problem was himself. I don't think his heart was ever into boxing. Jack ruined it for him.

[hagler04]

As mrbig said, the big question here is Archie's chin holding up vs Quarry's killer left hooks. I do think a peak HW Moore (circa 1954) could edge Jerry in the boxing department, but Quarry had the speed and skill to land some big punches. This is a very good matchup and I couldn't be confident backing either guy,

[don1234]

If you could wave a magic wand and make Jerry a LH he would be a decided underdog against Archie. At heavyweight the Mongoose's record was hit or miss. For every victory over a top heavy like Nino Valdes there was the shocking performance against a young phenom like Patterson. Jerry would be a mild underdog in a close contest. If Jerry were to win it would almost have to be by kayo - which he could do in a heavyweight encounter with Archie.

[Elwill7847]

Pound for Pound, Archie was a better fighter. But, at HW, I'd go with Quarry either by decision or late TKO. of course, I'm talking about the Quarry of the Spencer/Mathis/Foster/Lyle/Shavers fights.

[mrbig1]

Pound for Pound, Archie was a better fighter. But, at HW, I'd go with Quarry either by decision or late TKO. of course, I'm talking about the Quarry of the Spencer/Mathis/Foster/Lyle/Shavers fights.

You guys have talked me into it. Quarry at 198 could beat Moore. Moore will have his rounds and land big counters. Not enough for a in prime Quarry to worry about.

[JaKob]

Id go with quarry without hesistation here. Quarry at his best was going to be too much for archie. The disparity in power and durability is going to be too large for Archie to offset with his crafty skillset. Also need to consider that Quarry was by no means a slouch technically.

Quarry by KO in the mid to late rounds.

[SageBrush]

As much as i try to it is hard for me to banish two rounds from my mind, the first round of Moore Vs Durelle and the hellacious fist round Jerry presented to Frazier in their first fight, the 2nd and 3rd rounds were not walkovers to Joe either, when you put these rounds together the conclusions are for me hard to ignore, however it is not fair to Archie to pick these See-Saw moments, there are indeed many If's and buts, Which Jerry turns up is usually the starting point, but assuming its an On-Song Jerry, then i think when he cuts loose he will have too much for Archie, Archie is the consistant one, its Jerry who has those parameters of performance, but when i watch Jerry "Cut Loose" as he did with Frazier, or his finishing Salvos against Foster and Shavers, i think he would eventually Nail Archie and turn it on for the Termination, Was Archie really any better than the Patterson that Jerry Beat ? for Speed and boxing Ability ?
i think not, so another vote for Jerry from this quarter.

[Kyoodle]

Agree that Quarry brings too much at 190 for Archie. As time goes on I believe Jerry remains one of the most underrated fighters of all time. He was simply born 20 years too soon, or too late, depending on what your opinion of the respective HW eras of those times are.

Moore wouldn't stop him, and would find it hard to keep up with Jerry's work ethic/punch output. Quarry by stoppage somewhere around the final third of the fight.

[apollack]

Moore by clear unanimous decision. Way too smart, skillful, and cagey for Quarry, and had enough defense, power, and a good enough jab to offset Jerry. Remember, Moore still went 9 rounds with a Marciano who put in an all-out ferocious nonstop attack of brutal power blows the likes of which most fighters, including Quarry, simply could not do unless they wanted to be totally gassed out in about 3 rounds. Moore was a really special boxer who is being underrated here, I think. Moore fought plenty of strong fighters, bigger fighters, and skillful fighters, and more often than not found a way to win.

[walshb]

CW up to 190 lbs or up to 200 lbs?

I am very surprised that anyone is picking Moore. As great a LHW as he was, Quarry is too much at 200 lbs for Moore. Moore came up short several times out of his weight zone. Quarry has it all to beat Moore. Natural size, power, the chin and the strength; plus he has a good boxing brain. Quarry was a top heavyweight in a golden era. Moore was a LHW at peak. He was not good enough when he had to weigh in close to 190 and 200 lbs. Just not up to it.

And, Patterson never beats Quarry. He did beat Moore. I pick Quarry over Charles and JJW too.

[apollack]

Moore beat plenty of big men, guys just as big as Quarry. Buddy Walker, Curtis Sheppard, George Fitch, Bob Sikes, Abel Cestac, Albert Lovell, Alfredo Lagay, Embrel Davidson, Leonard Dugan, Nino Valdes, Bob Baker, Bob Dunlap, Willie Bean, James Parker, Hans Kalbfell, Alaine Cherville, Bert Whitehurst, Bob Albright, Willi Besmanoff, Howard King, Charley Norkus, Pete Rademacher, Alejandro Lavorante ALL weighed over 190 pounds, most of whom had respectable records or experience at the time they got beat. Moore fought plenty of other lesser men over 190 who I left off, as well as many in the high or mid 180s who were no slouches either. The idea of Moore being a light heavy who cannot handle big men is a myth. He did plenty well with big men, even guys in the 200s. Quarry for most of his career was in the 190s or low 200s. Nothing Moore hasn't seen or dealt with.

[JaKob]

Moore beat plenty of big men, guys just as big as Quarry. Buddy Walker, Curtis Sheppard, George Fitch, Bob Sikes, Abel Cestac, Albert Lovell, Alfredo Lagay, Embrel Davidson, Leonard Dugan, Nino Valdes, Bob Baker, Bob Dunlap, Willie Bean, James Parker, Hans Kalbfell, Alaine Cherville, Bert Whitehurst, Bob Albright, Willi Besmanoff, Howard King, Charley Norkus, Pete Rademacher, Alejandro Lavorante ALL weighed over 190 pounds, most of whom had respectable records or experience at the time they got beat. Moore fought plenty of other lesser men over 190 who I left off, as well as many in the high or mid 180s who were no slouches either. The idea of Moore being a light heavy who cannot handle big men is a myth. He did plenty well with big men, even guys in the 200s. Quarry for most of his career was in the 190s or low 200s. Nothing Moore hasn't seen or dealt with.

And none of these guys are Jerry Quarry. Is there a disparity as it pertains to depth of skillset and experience? Yeah sure Moore was as crafty as they come. That being said Jerry had some real skills on him, could really crack, and was crafty enough especially in the pocket to get it on target. He was no Rocky Marciano but he had a far more polished and refined skillset. His raw talent and physical advantages in terms of size, strength, durability would be imposed in such a way it would offset Moore's advantages. Jerry was far too good for Moore to play cute and give him a boxing lesson. Far from crude he'd be able to lay leather on Moore's chin and i doubt it's up for the task.

[sr71ko]

You guys have talked me into it. Quarry at 198 could beat Moore. Moore will have his rounds and land big counters. Not enough for a in prime Quarry to worry about.

Good points mrbig1 and Elwill7847. However, I think a key factor is crusierweight 190 or less or at the new limit of 200 lbs? 190 or less gives Archie a good chance. Over 190-200lbs highlights Quarry's edge in size and strength. 190 lbs....Archie 55-45 chance of winning by tko on cuts. Over 190-200lbs where Archie's weight was more sloppy, have to give the edge to Quarry by tko/ko. The question for me is what happens when Quarry blitzes Moore? Does Quarry stop Moore like he did Shavers or gets taken apart like Ken Norton did him? This is the key to the fight.

[Elwill7847]

Good points mrbig1 and Elwill7847. However, I think a key factor is crusierweight 190 or less or at the new limit of 200 lbs? 190 or less gives Archie a good chance. Over 190-200lbs highlights Quarry's edge in size and strength. 190 lbs....Archie 55-45 chance of winning by tko on cuts. Over 190-200lbs where Archie's weight was more sloppy, have to give the edge to Quarry by tko/ko. The question for me is what happens when Quarry blitzes Moore? Does Quarry stop Moore like he did Shavers or gets taken apart like Ken Norton did him? This is the key to the fight.

The Jerry Quarry of 1969 - 1973 (starting with the Mathis fight, ending with the Shavers fight) would, IMO, beat Archie at HW. From 1974 on, Jerry was a little past it and Archie most likely beats that version of Quarry.

I believe Jerry would stop Moore somewhere between 8th and 10th round in a pretty good scrap.