Fernando Vargas Vs Denny Moyer

SageBrush · 10-04-2005, 07:47 AM

We all know about Fernando's capabilities. his exploits being so recent, but how would he do with a great old pro from yesteryear, in Denny Moyer, not a great one shot hitter, but tough and so experienced, how could you not be when you have shared a ring with - and can boast a win over a veritable who's-who against such as Robinson, Griffith, Paret Atkins Ortega, Harrington Teddy Wright, Giambra and Paddy and Tony Demarco amongst others, he also lost to some of the aforementioned, as well as to Archer, Jordan Rodriguez, Dupas, Little, Benvenuti Ect ) Talk about being unprotected and constantly operating in at the deep end, !

Post Monzon in italy, where Denny was almost certainly booked for defeat, but was controversially stopped whilst fighting back from a shaky spell, the ring Headlined is Report "Roman Scandel" Danny became something of a 70's high class Middleweight Trialhorse,

- But 10 years Earlier…A Prime Lt Middle Moyer against the supposedly Ferocious One ?

robertk · 10-05-2005, 08:37 AM

I think he'd have a picnic in there with a guy like vargas. I sure don't like that vargas defense whatsoever and an old pro is hardly going to have problems penetrating it.

I think vargas is always going to look better and fare better against guys that are right in front of him as opposed to a guy that uses his legs/angles/fires combos. And that's what moyer did====plus just a huge huge edge in experience for a lot of years. I, for one, didn't ever think vargas was the type to stay on the scene at the top of his game for very long. He didn't either. That defense and leaning in style is simply going to wear out the body and skin===unless you're the rare breed like a basilio or lamotta. Man, can you imagine putting vargas in with a jake lamotta? Denny moyer would be bad enough.

GorDoom · 10-05-2005, 06:06 PM

Denny by easy UD. He was just technically to proficient for a guy like Vargas.

GorDoom

gregbeyer · 10-05-2005, 11:19 PM

wow...i guess this is closer than o'grady-duran.

now we are talking at their peaks right...not vargas on 'roids...oh wait that didn't work did it?

well.... we can go by the level of competition,experience and longevity. at this point at which none will argue fernando is on his last legs denny was about a quarter of the way thru his career. so for level of competition in their first 28 fights you gotta go with fernie but after that i think...denny. its crazy because with 28 fights vargas might get on the undercard in those days. moyer had almost a 140 fights against the guys named above and vargas is shot after 28 fights! do you know how good denny was to have fought at that level for that long? how close do you think vargas will get to 140?

greg

GorDoom · 10-06-2005, 01:28 AM

Let's put it this way, between the ages of 18 & 20 Denny fought this line up:

Johnny Saxton Portland, OR W 10
Dec 11 Tony Dupas Portland, OR W 10

1959
Jan 2 Gaspar Ortega New York W 10
Feb 17 Vince Martinez Portland, OR W 10
Jul 10 Don Jordan Portland, OR L 15
(For World Welterweight Title)
Sep 3 Paddy DeMarco Portland, OR KO 10
Dec 10 Virgil Akins Portland, OR W 10

1960
Jan 19 Pat Lowry Seattle KO 3
Feb 10 Tony DeMarco Boston KO 2
Mar 11 Emile Griffith New York L 10
Apr 26 Emile Griffith Porland, OR W 10
Aug 16 Benny Paret New York NY W 10

Look at those names & then talk to me about Vargas possibly beating Moyer.

GorDoom

kikibalt · 10-06-2005, 01:54 PM

I can't see Vargas beating Moyer, moyer to old school
for Vargas, i think Moyer would box's his pants off

Frank B.

StingerKarl · 10-06-2005, 05:41 PM

Well; I think it would have been a good fight.
This is a good matchup, IMO between two very good Champions.
I would go with Moyer here by late TKO.
Karl

GorDoom · 10-06-2005, 06:14 PM

I disagree Karl. Vargas is simply not on the same level as a fighter as Moyer was. Aside from impressively beating Quartey & arguably losing in a close decision victory over Winky, who the hell has Vargas ever beaten that was a world class fighter?

Nobody.

GorDoom

StingerKarl · 10-06-2005, 09:04 PM

Well I like Moyer to stop him, but Vargas was no slouch at his peak.
The guy had his share of balls and would fight to the death-you have to give him credit for that much, don't ya?
IMO he would have given most any jr middleweight a run for their money-but no way he beats Moyer.
For instance; both Maurice Hope and Ayub Kalule would have beaten Vargas-I put Fernando below their level historically.
Fernando is no punk, and could fight a bit.
Moyer TKO 12 Vargas

GorDoom · 10-07-2005, 12:50 AM

"The guy had his share of balls and would fight to the death-you have to give him credit for that much, don't ya?"

Absolutely!

I wasn't trying to imply that Vargas was a bum - far from it. At one point he was very good & developing into an excellent fighter. I think he was actually rushed to fast by his management. & the beat down by Tito was absolutely brutal. The one against Oscar only slightly less so.

Balls? I would NEVER question his. But the fact remains that the only world class fighter he ever clearly beat was Quartey. & in the big picture Vargas was simply not on the world class level of a Moyer.

Ronald Lipton · 10-07-2005, 01:08 AM

Denny Moyer was in with guys who were a University of Higher learning about boxing.

It would be a tough boy against a nightmare, a citadel of boxing knowledge who would make Vargas feel like everything he thought he could do in the ring was not happening.

It would be like someone just hitting a heavy bag without sparring for 5 years and then getting in the ring with Giardello, Pep or Robinson and try to hit them the shots that the heavy bag let you hit it with.

Vargas would take all his Rinside colorful new trunks, new shoes, entourgage into the ring, and DennyMoyer in his G&S white trunks with the black stripe and black boxing shoes by Tuf-Wear, would knock the piss out of the kid and frustrate him so much he would have to take his macho nuts to a psychiatrist who would have to sodium pentathol his ass to make him forget the humiliating experience of being in the ring with a real pro fighter from an era that is gone forever.

rocky111 · 10-07-2005, 04:18 PM

Great posts and very knowledgable. Denny was also a national aau champ. His level of comp for his age is STUNNING. You guys made all the points. All I can add is for a unbeliever to get a tape of early vintage Moyer and then judge. Denny was one of the best of his very powerful era.

kikibalt · 10-07-2005, 05:42 PM

I pick Moyer b/c of the guys he fought on the
way up compare to the guys Vargas fought , an
like i said before i think Moyer would take Vargas
to school an give him a few lessons he would never
forget

Frank B.