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Thread: Is there any substance to the rumor of Carnera KO Sharkey being "fixed"?

  1. #151
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    If you can not prove

    Your facts. Don't present them as such.

    When you make a declaration in this manner, expect to be asked to provide something to back it up.

    If you CAN not or WILL not, I suggest either you DON'T present it as a Fact or you present it as a Belief.

    No offense to anyone on this board, But I'm not simply going to take anyone's WORD on something presented as an undeniable FACT without something to back it up.

    ANd I CERTAINLY am not going to take someone's word on something they obtained from a nameless, faceless third party.

    Not going to do it. And if this is deemed rude or disrespectful, well just label me a rabble rouser who likes to challenge authority as well as his elders. I'd label myself as something else personally.

    Agian, I point to my "Arcel calling Holmes the greatest ever" analogy.

    Anyone going to buy it if I am unable or unwilling to provide definitive proof Arcel said this?

    Hawk

  2. #152
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    Re: Is there any substance to the rumor of Carnera KO Sharkey being "fixed"?

    Lookit fellas. Im SHARING with you conversations Ive had about boxing with guys I dont think very many other guys on this board would have had a chance to converse with on the subject. I recieved these conversations because I was respected and trusted. These were not guys who stand on corners and yell out loud. They have earned my respect in these matters and have no reason to lie. They DO HAVE INTEGRITY in ways the average guy would fail in. Given what I know about boxing and money, given my own eyes and the knowledge I have about life, I CHOSE TO BELIEVE THESE MEN AND WHAT THEY TOLD ME. I ask no one else to believe any of this. I am only sharing.

  3. #153
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    Rocky

    I have no issues or arguements with what you previously shared given that is is presented in this manner.

    Hawk

  4. #154
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    Re: Is there any substance to the rumor of Carnera KO Sharkey being "fixed"?

    Quote Originally Posted by rocky111
    Lookit fellas. Im SHARING with you conversations Ive had about boxing with guys I dont think very many other guys on this board would have had a chance to converse with on the subject. I recieved these conversations because I was respected and trusted. These were not guys who stand on corners and yell out loud. They have earned my respect in these matters and have no reason to lie. They DO HAVE INTEGRITY in ways the average guy would fail in. Given what I know about boxing and money, given my own eyes and the knowledge I have about life, I CHOSE TO BELIEVE THESE MEN AND WHAT THEY TOLD ME. I ask no one else to believe any of this. I am only sharing.
    And please keep sharing with us, Rocky!

  5. #155
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    Experiences and Beliefs.......

    have never been an issue for me, if that is what is being intimated that I have a beef with.

    Hawk

  6. #156
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    Re: Is there any substance to the rumor of Carnera KO Sharkey being "fixed"?

    Just looking at this fight the other day -- the kayo does look a little theatrical. Sharkeys reaction to the blow seems out of proportion, and he goes face down without moving for a very long time. Looks a little fake.

    However, throughout the first 5 rds, Sharkey does genuinely look to be trying to knock Primos block off.

    Very weird fight. Hard to work out.

  7. #157
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    Re: Is there any substance to the rumor of Carnera KO Sharkey being "fixed"?

    I have stayed out of this one for the most part but my two cents are as follows ...

    Carnera was not a championship caliber fighter.

    Carnera was a mob creation and built much of his record on fixes.

    Even giving Primo the benefit of the doubt, that he got better over time, that he made some use of his size and strength, that he developed a decent jab, that he always was in good condition, that while his chin was average he had decent recooperative powers and that without question he had a world class heart, that maybe because of style and circumstances he might have jabbed, hugged and held his way to few legit victories over much smaller , world class guys, maybe,.....all that being said, Carnera was a musclebound, weak puncher. For me to believe he took out Sharkey with one punch is hard to believe.

    The film is inconclusive based on the angle. In addition, Sharkey falls face first, what seems a bit unnatural based on the punch.

    Sharkey himself seemed like a pragmatic sort, one who might take a dive for a buck and hope for a rematch ....keep in mind how he thrashed Primo not long before ...

    That being said, who knows ... it definately looks shady to me ...

    Did DeLisa tell his meeting with Sharkey story yet in this thread where he met an ancient Sharkey in an old age home and Sharkey told him Carnera could never touch him on his worst day ?
    Last edited by HE Grant; 08-02-2008 at 08:03 AM.

  8. #158
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    Re: Is there any substance to the rumor of Carnera KO Sharkey being "fixed"?

    When a 6'6" 260 or so pound man with a long reach hits a guy about 200 pounds on the chin with some nice shots, as Carnera did to Sharkey, funny things can happen. No one said Carnera didn't have a bit of a punch. His KO record proves it. Not all those fights can be fixes. I saw Carnera kill Ernie Schaaf in the fight before Sharkey - with a jab! Was that a fix? I think that right uppercut he landed on Sharkey was legit, and Sharkey didn't see it coming. He had hit Jack with a number of those prior to the KO, as well as some solid jabs.

    Could Sharkey have taken a dive? Maybe. But just from what I saw on film, it looked legit. It isn't as if Sharkey was KO proof. Sure he didn't have a glass jaw, but he had been taken out twice before in his career, so you can't say him being KO'd was a total shock. 1924 LKOby9 Quinton Romero-Rojas, 1927 LKOby7 Jack Dempsey. 195-pound Dempsey hit him with one punch he didn't see, and he went down for the count. Is it possible that 260-pound Carnera mustered up similar power in that uppercut? Sure. He didn't have the same snap as Dempsey - but with that kind of weight behind his body - he didn't need to. Foreman didn't have much snap either, but sometimes when you are strong and heavy handed, you can do that.
    Last edited by apollack; 08-02-2008 at 10:35 AM.

  9. #159
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    Re: Is there any substance to the rumor of Carnera KO Sharkey being "fixed"?

    His KO record is a joke. He was a mobbed up fighter. Poor Earnie died from an accumulative effect of damage over several fights. It was a freak thing. Carnera's shot most likely was only icing on the cake. Freak things happen. That is zero argument for Carnera being a KO hitter.

    I ask the same question to everyone who makes arguments that Carnera was legit , championship material ... how do you explain his post Louis record? While still a young man, 28, but dropped by the mob, he lost as many fights as he won, several by KO against second tier opposition and then retired.

  10. #160
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    Re: Is there any substance to the rumor of Carnera KO Sharkey being "fixed"?

    Here is some coverage of the fight.

  11. #161
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    Re: Is there any substance to the rumor of Carnera KO Sharkey being "fixed"?

    I have actually seen I think about as much from that fight that exists .. there is no doubt a fired up Carnera appears to be giving his all...again it is Sharkey that puzzles me ... he looks cautious, lethargic and not the fighter that dominated Carnera a year earlier ... it is weird ... to me it looks rotten ... as posters know I have been wrong before ....it to me is a who knows ???

    Does any footage of Carnera's defense of Uzcuden in Rome exist ? I have never seen any and would like to ...

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