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Thread: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

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    Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    espn wire servies report the name of Evander Holyfield comes up in the recent steroid bust. Evander states that he bought online meds for his dad via his sister.



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    ORLANDO, Fla. -- Athletes were involved as customers of an illicit steroid distribution network that led authorities to raid a pharmacy in Orlando and investigate another in Mobile, Ala., a New York prosecutor said. The probes have led to the arrests of four officials from the companies.

    Albany County (N.Y.) District Attorney P. David Soares refused to identify any steroid recipients, saying prosecutors were focused on producers and distributors within the ring. The Times Union of Albany first disclosed the investigation on Tuesday, citing unidentified sources.


    "I understand that the involvement of athletes and celebrities makes this a sexy story, but I assure you we are not, at this point, we are not concerned with the celebrity factor," Soares said. "Our focus here is to shut down distribution channels."


    In the Mobile case, the Times Union said Los Angeles Angels outfielder Gary Matthews Jr., former heavyweight champion Evander Holyfield and former baseball star Jose Canseco, an admitted steroid user, were allegedly on the customer list of Applied Pharmacy Series, whose two owners have been indicted by an Albany County grand jury.



    When reached by ESPN.com's Mike Fish on Wednesday, Holyfield said he was "not overly concerned about the situation." He said his only link to Alabama and medical services there was the purchase of medication for his father, who died of a heart ailment in January.


    "For years, I bought all his medication out of Alabama," Holyfield said. "My sister takes care of that, every month, all his bills and stuff."

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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    I wonder if holyfield knows that lying is a sin too? as well as adultery. I'm no saint, but i also don't go around putting bible passages after my name. lets see, heart condition that disappears, baldness, unusual weight and muscle gain, linked now with steroid purchases......

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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    The heart condition was supposed to be too much liquid after the fight or something, an error of the medical staff wasn't it.

    Balding happens to most men i think, anywhere between 18 to 40s.

    As for the muscle gain... well he is a full time athlete with a team of nutritionists and what have you who had the expertise and equipment to build him up into heavyweight. I know people who have built up a stone or two stone in my gym with no need for steroids.

    Not trying to sound too nieve, but it is conceivable that Holyfield, like Bruno, is just a gym freak with the right diet. Didn't they catch Botha and Toney pretty easily?

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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    sure its possible. but something about him looking like a water filled balloon has me doubting normal muscle growth.

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    I'm in the middle here

    Philly, I agree with your point about his appearance. Which is why it makes me wonder why Evander would not have been the poster child for a steroid target by the Govt for years now.

    I look at Mike Weaver, who didn't even lift until his later years in his career and you see a physique that leaves you in Awe. Same thing with Ken Norton.

    The difference with Evander, is he bulked up from Cruiseweight. He DID lift weights. He has surrounded himself with trainers who themselves have used roids. The Heart, and other health issues he's had. Hey, if I am the govt and I want to crack down on athletes using illegal steroids, I'm having an entire division camping out on Holyfield's front lawn.

    Now maybe he simply was never a focus on investigation previously. But given the red flags that to even someone as ignorant as myself is to steroid usage, I would think he would have been a focal point for years. If he was and nothing came up, well maybe there was nothing there or maybe he got around being caught.

    But to think that with his being a Heavyweight since 1989 and only now, in 2007 are serious allegations hitting the headlines, well maybe there wasn't anything there all along.

    We shall see.

    Hawk

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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    I have always believed that Holyfield is juicing. Tommy Morrison admitted to using roids, if I'm not mistaken.

    I've always wondered if the Klitschko brothers are on roids, too.

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    Well Nothing is confirmed

    This is still speculation. The only link is his name on a customer list.

    Quite possibly, Evander's story about purchasing meds for his father is indeed legit. I Think until anything more direct comes out, he should be given the benefit of the doubt.

    We need to wait until something more substantive comes about before anyone jumps the gun.

    Hawk

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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    Hypothetical question: if it is proven he was on roids, do you strip him of any titles he won while on them?

    I thought it was interesting. I saw a show on TV about cocaine that said ballplayers in the 1880s freely took and advertised coke-laced products. Yet Cooperstown, to my knowledge, never thought about re-examining players' stats from that era.

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    I say we need to wait until

    There is at least an indictment before we pose that question.

    As it is right now, we could just as easily pose that question towards Mike Tyson. What if it is discovered Tyson took roids? Do we strip him of his achievements?

    No one has anything on Tyson? Well, as of right now, as far as we know, no one has anything on Holyfield either.

    Hawk

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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    Cocaine was not illegal in the 1880's, not illegal in fact until 1914. Steroids used for performance enhancement without a prescription are.

    As for Holyfield, to prove he was on them I guess we'd need him to have failed a test during his championship years. Proof of him buying them is so close but no close enough to proof of taking them. Sure why buy them if not to use them, but all sorts of concocted answers could be given. "For my friends" etc.

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    La Parka
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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    He did it I was watching Jim Rome is burning on espn and he used a fake name "Evan Fields" and was smart enough to put his real phone number down when whoever discovered this, called the number what do you know Evander Holyfield picked up the phone

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    La parka

    Is this something that was announced recently? And exactly what was it he "did"?

    And this was uncovered on Jim Rome's show? I;m curious just how relevent anything on Rome's show is/was. I can't find anything mentioning this on ESPN's site.

    Again, I think we need to wait until something is actually "formal".

    Hawk

    Addendum: No wonder I found so little at ESPN. It's apparently a Sports Illustrated Article:

    Complete denial
    SI: Holyfield allegedly received steroids, HGH via alias
    Posted: Wednesday February 28, 2007 11:19PM; Updated: Thursday March 1, 2007 3:48PM

    Sports Illustrated reporters Luis Fernando Llosa and L. Jon Wertheim are tracking the investigation of an illegal steroid distribution network that has implicated pro athletes. On Tuesday, they accompanied agents on a coordinated raid of an Orlando compound pharmacy and a Jupiter, Fla., "anti-aging" clinic that investigators allege conspired to fraudulently prescribe steroids, human growth hormone and other performance enhancing drugs over the Internet.

    SI.com: In addition to major league outfielder Gary Matthews Jr., another prominent athlete whose name has surfaced in media reports is Evander Holyfield, the four-time heavyweight boxing champ. What do you know about his situation?

    Llosa/Wertheim: Ironically, Holyfield's name does not appear in the law enforcement documents we reviewed. However, a patient by the name of "Evan Fields" caught investigators' attention. "Fields" shares the same birth date as Holyfield -- Oct. 19, 1962. The listed address for "Fields" was 794 Evander, Fairfield, Ga. 30213. Holyfield has a very similar address. When we called the phone number that, according to the documents, was associated with the "Fields" prescription, Holyfield answered.

    SI.com: Is he tied to raids of compound pharmacies and "anti-aging" clinics as well?

    Llosa/Wertheim: This case appears to be a little different. Rather than using the internet and receiving the prescriptions through the mail, "Fields" allegedly picked them up from a private Georgia urologist whose offices were raided as part of this ongoing investigation. But authorities tell us the drugs came from Applied Pharmacy, the Mobile, Ala., compound pharmacy the DEA raided last fall.

    SI.com: Do you know which drugs were involved?

    Llosa/Wertheim: According the records we reviewed, in June 2004, the individual that authorities believe to be Holyfield picked up three vials of testosterone, two vials of Glukor and injection supplies. Less than a week later, according to the document, he picked up five vials of Saizen, a brand of human growth hormone (HGH), and related supplies. In Sept. 2004, he returned for a follow-up visit for hypogonadism.

    SI.com: Does Holyfield have an explanation?

    Llosa/Wertheim: We contacted him today. He denied knowledge and offered to get back to us, which he never did. He did, however, release a statement through Main Events, the boxing promotion company. "I do not use steroids. I have never used steroids. I resent that my name has been linked to known steroid users by sources who refuse to be identified in order to generate publicity for their investigation. I'm disappointed that certain members of the media fell for this ploy and chose to use my name in headlines and publish my photo alongside stories ... about an investigation into a practice that has nothing to do with me or what I stand for."

    SI.com: At 44, Holyfield is still fighting. What is boxing's policy with respect to steroids and HGH?

    Llosa/Wertheim: Most commissions do ban steroids and HGH. But again -- and we can't stress this enough -- this investigation is about the chain of supply and this network. It's not about which athletes are or aren't using performance-enhancing drugs. The document makes no assertion that Holyfield used the drugs that he is alleged to have received.

    Boxing is not like other sports where there is a league and union that agrees on standard policies such as drug testing. In boxing, anti-doping rules can vary by state commission. We spoke with several officials with the Nevada Athletic Commission, and while HGH is on a list of banned substances, boxers are not tested for it. Marc Ratner, the former head of the Nevada commission, also told us that boxers are only tested when they fight -- not out of competition. Still, a number of fighters in recent years, including James Toney and Fernando Vargas, have been sanctioned for using performance-enhancing drugs, serving suspensions of 90 days and nine months, respectively.

    SI.com: Has Holyfield's name come up before?

    Llosa/Wertheim: He has never tested positive. However Dr. Margaret Goodman, chairman of the medical advisory board of Nevada Athletic Commission, says that as early as 1994, when Holyfield fought Michael Moorer and suffered heart problems, the medical arm of the Commission questioned Holyfield about possible HGH use. "There were questions [because] the abnormalities Evander had with his heart were findings that could have been consistent with growth hormone use. The problem was there was no test and Evander denied any use of growth hormone."

    Goodman went on to say that she believes that use of HGH is widespread in the sport. "I think it's readily available and used in boxing," she says. "I think we should have adopted the World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) standards years ago. Boxing continues to hide its head in the sand that there's a problem with anabolic steroids and drugs like growth hormone -- and also substances like clenbuterol that guys are using in combination with growth hormone and anabolic steroids to give them an unfair advantage."

    Luis Llosa can be reached at luisfernando_llosa@simail.com
    Last edited by hawk5ins; 03-01-2007 at 09:48 PM.

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    Tyson & roids

    Interesting thing about Tyson, Ruddock was making a big deal of roids before his fight with LL in 1992. He was very paranoid about his opponents taking them, and he was demanding LL take every test because he was willing to take every test. Then he said he did the same thing before his Tyson fiight, however then Tyson actually paid Ruddock $25K so that Tyson wouldnt have to take a roids test. Ruddock said at that time he wasnt in a financial position to turn down such an offer. Anyhow i found that quite intriguing.

    As for Holyfield, stuff like Creatine (combined with gym program) can bulk you up immensely in a relatively short space of time, and that is mostly water retention as opposed to complete muscle development.

    I dunno, i wouldn't be amazed if Holy was on roids, but it would definitely sour my day.

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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    Holyfield was able to add lean muscle mass to his his already muscular frame while continuing to train like a spartan using a boxer's training regime. It's very difficult to add lean muscle tissue when you are expending so much energy and burning as many calories as Holyfield would have when sparring, running, bag work, shadow-boxing etc...

    If Holyfield had bulked up on a weight routine between fights then trained down, I might find it easier to believe that the muscle gain had occurred naturally, but Holyfield never seemed to be much above his fighting weight between fights if at all.

    Holyfield also added this muscle later in his career so I don't believe it was a case of him filling out naturally as he matured.

    I have long suspected both Holyfield and Tyson as well as others of being steroid users. Let's see.............steroids will provide an increase in size and strength, training and injury recoverability as well as increase in aggression.

    Duh.

  16. #16
    mike
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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    isuspect its true--unfortunately--for holyfied and maybe tyson--tyson perhaps in later tears. well see. if so--like baseball--a steriod and then pre steroid area in the heays--may be neccesarily designated.--not that either one wwas a great,great heavy--steriods only do so much.

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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    Holyfield in the first phase of his career seemed to not be in the red zone (when he weighed in the 205-208 range) . . .that's only 15 lbs over the cruiserweight limit, which he was having problems making anyway. Spinks bulked up in a similar fashion and no-one accuses Shillstone of injecting his fighters with HGH.

    It was for the 2nd Bowe fight and thereafter, when Holyfield was weighing a bulked up 215 and higher, and having his heart problems, eerie energy lapses in fights etc. whicn I think he would have started using illegal substances.

    Ironically, despite some solid wins, this was when he began really declining as a fighter.

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    mike
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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    yeah, he was over doing something--and at times--he would flat out suddenly run out of gas. weird.--to much muscle i guess and overtrained.

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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    I think Holyfield has been on the juice pretty much from the beginning.

    For the second Tyson fight, his body didn't look human for God sakes! He used to be trained by Lee Haney, who was a former multi-Mr. Olympia winner. Haney was training him when he had the problems with his heart in the first Moorer fight. If HGH is his drug of choice it would make sense because it's very difficult to test for and a reliable test for it has only been developed in the past few years.

    Other heavyweights who have surely juiced over the years? Tyson, Morrison and Frank Bruno for sure. I could go on with a list as long as your arm for other divisions. Vinny Pazienza being number one.

    TKS
    Last edited by TKO Tom; 03-03-2007 at 12:49 PM.

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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    Quote Originally Posted by TKO Tom
    I think Holyfield has been on the juice pretty much from the beginning.

    For the second Tyson fight, his body didn't look human for God sakes! He used to be trained by Lee Haney, who was a former multi-Mr. Olympia winner. Haney was training him when he had the problems with his heart in the first Moorer fight. If HGH is his drug of choice it would make sense because it's very difficult to test for and a reliable test for it has only been developed in the past few years.

    Other heavyweights who have surely juiced over the years? Tyson, Morrison and Frank Bruno for sure. I could on with a list as long as your arm for other divisions. Vinny Pazienza being number one.

    TKS
    thats very interesting--but in boxing--how much of an edge does it give when in prime ?? i dont know. in baseball at bat--being tight doesnt hurt--in boxing--you have to be loose---its a huge difference. nevertheless--steriods in the right amounts has to have some degree of edge--provided you dont rely on that and train to a peak , nonetheless.

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    mike
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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    also, boxing is the most macho sport in the world--just how many real warriors would think to use it --unless they had self doubts of a fairly serious kind.

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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    steroid use/abuse is a 2 way street. In boxing, its as detrimental as it is beneficial. Sure it helps put on the muscle mass, but boxing isn't all about muscles, just ask andrew golota. Look at the natural heavyweights of the 70's and 80's, Ali, Holmes,Foreman,Liston,Shavers, Lyle,witherspoon, young,cooney,bobick. Big men, but not loaded with muscle mass. In their primes, Ali and Holmes never looked like evander holyfield. Weight lifting and nutrition was not as big back then, they did more road work, hit the heavy bag, and chopped wood. They could also go 15 rounds where Shannon Briggs is sucking air after 4. Roids might be a shortcut, but it does not make up for real conditioning. I think the main reason for steroid use is money. Use steroids, put on the pounds, get a million dollar payday as a heavyweight. It worked for James toney. I just hate when they get in front of the press and deny, deny, deny.

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    mike
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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    agreed above.

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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    Although Evander has a great physique, I do not think it's absolutely 'out of this world'. He was always fairly ripped even as an amateur in LA. Ken Norton had an even better physique and I think the fact that Holy is such a pro and gym freak who surrounds himself with so many nutritional and fitness experts, it's no wonder he always looked in superb condition.

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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    "Looked" being the key word.

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    "looked"

    HA! I got a charge out of that.

    Yeah by comparison, Frazier Never looked in condition!

    Still not ready to throw Evander under the bus yet on the steroids accusation yet, but one thing that was indeed misleading about his physique, was that there was no better "conditioned" heavyweight.

    Modern day training techniques, diet and philosophies can make you look the part. But Something must have been working for Marciano who NEVER tired out, a Soft, by comparison looking Frazier and an almost pear shaped Larry Holmes.

    I have always maintained that if you look STRICTLY at Physique, journeyman Mike Williams was the best Heavyweight ever.

    Now Evander certainly has proven to be a great fighter. But I think his physical appearance has led far too many to make "visual conclusions" on how he would have done agianst fellow greats within the division.

    Hawk

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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    Excerpts from a current SI.com article...

    In June 2004 a patient named Evan Fields picked up three vials of testosterone and related injection supplies from a Columbus, Ga., doctor, traced through Applied. Later that month Fields also obtained five vials of Saizen and three months later returned for treatment of hypogonadism, a condition whereby sex glands produce little or no hormones. Investigators noted that Fields shares both the birth date and home address of former heavyweight champion Evander Holyfield. What's more, when SI called a phone number on a Post-It note attached to the Fields patient file, Holyfield answered. (Holyfield, who at 44 continues to fight professionally, told SI that he knew nothing of the drugs. Through Main Events, the promotional company that represents him, he released a statement denying any steroid use.)


    The entire article is interesting:

    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200...x.html?cnn=yes

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    Re: "looked"

    Quote Originally Posted by hawk5ins
    HA! I got a charge out of that.

    Yeah by comparison, Frazier Never looked in condition!

    Still not ready to throw Evander under the bus yet on the steroids accusation yet, but one thing that was indeed misleading about his physique, was that there was no better "conditioned" heavyweight.

    Modern day training techniques, diet and philosophies can make you look the part. But Something must have been working for Marciano who NEVER tired out, a Soft, by comparison looking Frazier and an almost pear shaped Larry Holmes.

    I have always maintained that if you look STRICTLY at Physique, journeyman Mike Williams was the best Heavyweight ever.

    Now Evander certainly has proven to be a great fighter. But I think his physical appearance has led far too many to make "visual conclusions" on how he would have done agianst fellow greats within the division.

    Hawk
    In an attempt to further prove we not only do not share a brain, but I may not have much more than a notch-chord... I believe that what Hawk describes about appearances and physical attributes of the strictly bone and muscle type and how those color perceptions applies more to guys like Riddick Bowe and Lennox Lewis than it does to Holyfield.

    I do however remember a grizzled everything new sucks type guy like Lou Duva in some article in some rag talking about Evander being the best trained fighter in the world......... because of machines. Machines that monitored his heart, machines for zero gravity training and etc.

    It struck me then as silly, and that was before we had some proof negative of that (and before I could buy beer legally). He certainly was meticulously monitored, but who actually KNEW after collecting the data how to actually make Holyfield not look like he'd been doing the tour-de-france sans bike after 10 rounds after he entered the heavy ranks?

    I agree with Hawk Evander was not the be all and end all when it came to wind and lungs, but he did expend tons of energy in his fights... altogether fighting less like 'Big George does Perry Como' and more like maybe notch 8 on the Leon Spinks scale (which goes to 11.5).

    I don't think the default for most fans and boxing peeps is to look at Evander and based on abs feel that tips the scales in a fantasy match in his favor. Those with memories can recall the physique was indicating perhaps dedication...and they way he fought made it seem sometimes he never tired...while we watched him gasping and taking breathers mid-round.

    It IS interesting that some DO recall him being fresh and vital in the late rounds, rather than ragged but with enormous will and heart.
    Last edited by Sharkey; 03-06-2007 at 10:17 PM.

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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    Yes Evander was said by many to be the best 'conditioned' heavyweight.
    He may have had the best physique, but conditioned I say he was very high but not as conditioned as a peak Ali, Frazier, Holmes, Marciano.
    Holyfield's stamina was questionable at times

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    Re: Steroid Bust: Real Deal?!

    Evander vs Foreman, Holmes, Dokes, Bowe etc. had to take rests and sometimes just seemed to stall (this became a much bigger issue after the Tyson fights as vs Bean, Lewis, Ruiz etc. he could only fight about 30 seconds a round).

    Without a doubt in great physical condition (his late fight surges vs Bowe, Tyson, and Cooper are something to behold) but I wouldn't even say he was in the class conditioning wise of a prime Frazier, Marciano, Dempsey, Ali, Joe Louis, Max Schmeling and even lesser stalwarts like Ken Norton (I still consider his fight vs Larry Holmes as one of the most impressive displays of heart and conditioning ever in heavyweight boxing)

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