Ron Lipton: Q & A Thread

[Ronald Lipton]

Hi Frank,

how are the boys doing, well I hope.

yes it is true and I was right there at 230 Market Street Newark, 3 flights up at Mooksie's Gym. I wrote all about it on the Zone awhile back and then the system crashed here and all my writings were lost.

Joe Louis Adair then a good friend of mine and our mutual trainer, George Branch who is seen in the picture with me in my TV fight posted on the Zone awhile back, where I scored the amateur record 6 second KO in NJ.
Joe Louis Adair was with me in the audience on my way to the ring.

Anyway Joe was out of Witchita Kansas and was some smooth left hooker with no fear. I watched him stop Holly Mims on a cut eye in the Elizabeth Armory.

Carter did not like Joe and for whatever reason got into his boxing togs while drunk out of his mind and Joe knocked his dick in the dirt for him. Laid him out cold.

He got up and Joe did it again. They did a story on it in the old Boxing Illustrated but they got the locatio wrong.
It happened in Neward at Mooksies as did many other bizzare things like stabbings, shootings and I once saw a heavyweight named Thurman Johnson get his fingers chopped off by a man named Mark Murray who was a trainer in the gym.

The cops even brought a young fighter into be questioned by the name of Larry Hazzard, who was also there besides me.

Joe was one of the first guys to wear white boxing shoes besides Kid Gavilan and Cassius Clay.

Nice hearing from you,

Ron

[BDeskins]

Ron---I'm sure this has been asked and answered, but I missed it, so I was curious if you have ever considered writing a book about your life? It really sucks how you are being treated and I certainly hope that you can very soon be back in the ring. Have you ever considered contacting the HBO show "Real Sports?" Your story sounds very much like something that that program would jump at to tell.

[Ronald Lipton]

I appreciate that and yes it will be considered.

I never saw that program but will certainly look into it.

If I wrote the book it would be based on the highly unusual things I experienced as a uniformed police officer and later a Detective, my battles outside the ring with the KKK and crooked police who helped them and winning a lifetime civil rights achievement award, and of course the entire boxing background as a referee and fighter, and the legal battles in Federal courts I was lucky enough to win regarding these issues.

Thanks for your interest and support, much appreciated at this bad time.

Ron

[jyoungfan2]

[Juan C Ayllon]

Wouldn't you know it: I still had copies of these gems in my computer.

Here are a series of workout pieces put together by Ron and his son, Brett. They originally appeared at Ron's string before the original message board crashed.

Enjoy!

INSTRUCTOR RON LIPTON

INSTRUCTOR BRETT LIPTON

written by Ron Lipton, Boxing Instructor, for his BOXING STUDENTS.

BODY BUILDING EXERCISES, HIGHER REP PRINCIPLE FOR SHAPING, SYMMETRY, MUSCLE ENDURANCE

VERY IMPORTANT! THIS IS NOT A SIZE BUILDING WORKOUT WHICH WOULD NECESSITATE HEAVIER WEIGHT AND LOWER REPS, BUT RATHER, AN OVERALL CONDITIONING WORKOUT. MALE STUDENTS WILL BECOME MUCH MORE MUSCULAR AND FEMALE STUDENTS WILL LOSE FAT AND IMPROVE OVERALL APPEARANCE. THIS WORKOUT IN THE GYM COMBINED WITH THE BOXING CLASS WILL MAKE YOU LOOK AND FEEL LIKE A CHAMPION.

PLEASE READ THE FOLLOWING POINTS AND NOTES PRIOR TO STARTING YOUR SUGGESTED WORKOUT.

The gym workout is to be utilized and adjusted accordingly as per individual needs* combined with proper diet, rest, and an aerobic conditioning program geared to your present medical condition, lifestyle and other physical endeavors.

Train to your favorite music if you want, use a headset and get into it. Each rep and set is money in the bank and one step closer to a better you!

Train with deep concentration and focus on every second of what you are doing and warm up each muscle group with very low weights prior to start of new exercise. Really enjoy the workout!

Don't stretch when you are completely cold. Warm up and try to stretch the muscles you are working before and after each set if possible.

When changing exercises, you must do the first new set with light resistance, sending a message to that muscle that you will be calling upon it to extend and contract in a different plane of movement and at a different angle. THEN YOU CAN ADD WEIGHT IF SO DESIRED or ADD REPS WITH SAME WEIGHT.

Use little rest between sets Get your heartbeat up but do not strain yourself. You must work at your own pace...BUT DO THE REPS SLOWLY WITH FULL COMPLETE MOVEMENTS, DOING THE REP PROPERLY. Avoid chatting, socializing, losing focus or concentrating on what OTHERS are doing in the gym - this is your workout!

*See Coaches Ron or Brett Lipton for differences in compound movements as opposed to isolated exercises.

[Juan C Ayllon]

-2-

To avoid the pitfalls of injury, elbow strain, pulled muscles, etc., see coach for training tips. E.G. Avoid doing any heavy isolated tricep exercises FIRST, such as tricep bar or rope press downs, and or tricep extensions, but rather do light dumbbell warm-ups for the biceps first when training arms.

Try supinating light dumbbell curls either sitting or standing to warm up the elbow joint sufficiently first and help avoid the elbow twinge which comes with straining the tendons and ligaments in isolated movements. Always start your tricep workout well warmed up and with light press downs - gorging the area with blood - before going heavier in any isolated movement.

To help avoid knee injury while doing legs, start off with higher rep leg extensions which warm up the knee joint first BEFORE doing leg presses, squats or heavy movements.

Before doing squats, it also helps to warm up FIRST with some abdominal crunches and then SECOND with a set of 12 hyper extensions AFTER warming up and stretching.

The hyper extensions warm up the lumbar area of the lower back and this front & back warm up of the midsection and lower back enable you to lock in the mid-section which stabilizes you better for squats. See the Boxing coach for proper form, while utilizing continuous tension principle.

Do your workout 2-3 days per week-TUES & THURS OR MON & WED, or FRIDAY & SUNDAY - however you want to work it - but get at least ONE DAY REST OR MORE IN-BETWEEN. Do something for abs every day, and try to walk in the park each day for the fresh air.

DIET:

WATCH WHAT YOU EAT EVERY DAY. If you want to lose weight, eat smaller portions, train and eat instinctively.

Avoid starches, sugars, junk foods.

Minimize red meat and dairy products. GOOD SOURCES OF PROTEIN ARE: Egg whites, tuna, turkey and lean chicken.

Eat different fresh vegetables and fruits DAILY. Use romaine lettuce, spinach, and kale instead of iceberg lettuce because they contain more vitamins and minerals.

DRINK FRESH COLD WATER EVERY DAY. It is the best thirst quencher.

Get a Jack Lalane or comparable power juicer for melon, carrot, cucumber, celery, apple, parsley juices or any combination of vegetables or fruits.

[Juan C Ayllon]

-3-

SEE BOXING INSTRUCTORS ON PROPER FORM FOR DOING THESE EXERCISES CORRECTLY IN THE GYM TO HELP MINIMIZE RISK OF INJURY.

ALWAYS KEEP YOUR MID-SECTION TIGHT, FLEX IT, USE IT.


BACK:

WIDE GRIP LAT PULL-DOWNS-1ST SET MINIMUM 20 REPS,
MAXIMUM 35 REPS. 2ND SET-20-35 REPS.

SEATED CABLE ROWS-WIDE GRIP-1ST SET 20-35 REPS. 2ND SET-CHANGE GRIP TO OTHER HANDLE, CLOSE GRIP 20-35 REPS. ROW TO MIDSECTION, CONTRACT SCAPULA, EXTEND WITH A STRETCH, KNEES BENT, FEET FIRM ON PLATFORM.

IN BOXING GYM-T-BAR ROWS, 2 SETS OF 20-35 REPS. USE YOUR ARMS AS HOOKS. CONTRACT YOUR SCAPULA-SHOULDER BLADES, MAKE SURE YOU USE YOUR BACK, NOT ONLY ARMS.


CHEST:

CHOOSE 3 EXERCISES PER WORKOUT FOR CHEST.

IN THE BOXING GYM-HIGH CABLE CROSSOVERS-2 SETS 20-35 REPS. USE PROPER FORM. SEE COACH FOR PROPER FORM
INCLINE DUMBBELL PRESSES-2 SETS 20 REPS. 2ND SET, IF POSSIBLE, ADD WEIGHT.

INCLINE DUMBBELL FLYS-2 SETS 15 REPS.

FLAT BENCH DUMBBELL PULLOVERS-2 SETS 15 REPS

FLAT BENCH PRESS-3 SETS, 1 SET 20 REPS, 2ND SET 15 REPS, 3RD SET 12 REPS. THIS IS FOR BOXING TRAINING NOT MR. OLYMPIA CONTEST.

PUSHUP BARS, FEET ELEVATED ON BENCH, KNUCKLES FACING OUTWARD, ARMS CLOSE TO BODY-2 SETS 15 REPS. KNUCKLES FACING FORWARD 2 SETS 15 REPS, THIS EMULATES BENCH PRESS FOR PECS.

TO HIT THE AREA KNOWN AS PEC-DELT TIE IN-DO DIPS-2 SETS 15 REPS. THIS MOVEMENT CAN BE DUPLICATED WITH HIGH CABLE STATION EXERCISES, GRABBING THE STRAPS AND KEEPING ARMS CLOSE TO BODY EMULATING THE DIPPING EXERCISE, KNUCKLES FACING OUTWARD.

[Juan C Ayllon]

-4-

SHOULDERS:

SEATED MILITARY DUMBBELL PRESSES: 2 SETS.
1ST SET 15-20 REPS, 2ND SET 15-20 REPS ALSO. USE GOOD FORM, GET THAT BLOOD INTO THE AREA.

IMMEDIATELY COMBINE (SUPERSET) THIS WITH: LATERAL DUMBBELL RAISES-2 SETS 15 REPS SEE COACH FOR PROPER FORM

THEN GO TO POSTERIOR DELT EXERCISE-BENT OVER DUMBBELL LATERALS-2 SETS 15 REPS.

CABLE LATERALS AT CABLE STATION. ADJUST HANDLE FOR LOWER LEVEL. 2 SETS OF 12-15 REPS FOR EACH SHOULDER.


ARMS:

DO 2 EXERCISES PER BODY PART. 6 SETS TOTAL FOR BICEPS.


BICEPS:

SEATED OR STANDING DUMBBELL CURLS
2 SETS SUPINATING HAND, CONTINUOUS TENSION ON BICEPS, NO DEAD SPOTS, SEE COACH. 15-20 REPS TO THOROUGHLY WARM UP. THEN 2 SETS PALMS FACING OUTWARD, STRICT CURL. 15-20 REPS.

PREACHER BENCH CURLS WITH TWO DUMBBELLS.
2 SETS 15 REPS, USE GOOD FORM, USE PARTNER TO HELP WITH WEIGHTS. OR STANDING STRICT BARBELL CURL WITH STRAIGHT BAR OR CAMBERED CURL BAR. 2 SETS 15 REPS, THEN 12 REPS. CAN SUBSTITUTE THIS FOR STRICT STANDING DUMBBELL CURL.


TRICEPS:

TRICEP ROPE PULL-DOWNS-2 SETS 15-25 REPS

TRICEP ROPE EXTENSIONS-2 SETS 15-20 REPS. USE PROPER FORM, SEE COACH FOR PROPER FORM.

DUMBBELL TRICEP KICKBACKS-2 SETS OF 12-15 REPS. SEE COACH FOR PROPERFORM

YOU CAN ALSO SUPPLEMENT WITH PUSHUP BARS. ELEVATE YOUR FEET, KNUCKLES OUT, ARMS CLOSE FOR TRICEP LATERAL HEAD. THIS IS A COMPOUND MOVEMENT EXERCISE AND ALSO HITS PECS AND FRONTAL DELTS.

ALSO FOR TRICEPS - CLOSE GRIP BENCH PRESSES-15-25 REPS 2 SETS. THIS HITS LATERAL HEAD OF TRICEP. GRIP APPROX. 6" APART.

[Juan C Ayllon]

-5-

LEGS:


LEG EXTENSIONS: 2 SETS 15-25 REPS LEG CURLS: 2 SETS 15-20 REPS LEG PRESSES-20-25 REPS 2 SET

FULL SQUATS: USE A WEIGHT BELT AND PROPER FORM. MAKE SURE YOU ARE THOROUGHLY WARMED UP WITH THE BAR RESTING ON UPPER BACK, NOT YOUR NECK!!!

USE A TOWEL, JACKET FOR CUSHION. 3 SETS-HOLD YOUR STOMACH MUSCLES TIGHT TO SUPPORT MOVEMENT. KNEES SHOULD FLOAT OVER YOUR TOES, BACK STRAIGHT, EYES LOOKING TOWARD CEILING. USE THOSE BUTTOCK MUSCLES TO DRIVE WEIGHT UP, ALONG WITH YOUR QUADS. DO A SMOOTH REP WITH CONTINUOUS TENSION. DO NOT LOCK KNEES AT TOP OF MOVEMENT. BREATHE NATURALLY - BREATH DEEPLY THROUGH YOUR NOSE ON THE WAY DOWN AND EXHALE THROUGH YOUR MOUTH ON THE TOUGHER PART OF EXERCISE ON THE WAY UP.


CALVES:


STANDING CALF MACHINE AFTER ALL LEG WORK IS DONE. THIS IS LOCATED ON THE UPPER LEVEL OF MARIST GYM. 3 SETS OF 20 REPS. MAKE IT TOUGH AND DROP THAT HEEL ALL THE WAY DOWN UNTIL YOU FEEL IT BITE DEEP INTO THE CALF MUSCLE. GO ALL THE WAY UP LIKE A BALLERINA, SQUEEZE AT THE TOP AND THEN DROP DOWN AGAIN. GET A RHYTHM GOING.

SEATED CALF MACHINE FOR SOLEUS MUSCLE IN BACK OF CALF. 2 SETS OF 15 REPS.


ABDOMINALS:

DO ABS EVERY DAY. DO THE BOXING WORKOUT AS WE DO IN CLASS -FLOOR WORK.

IN GYM, INCLINE CRUNCHES WITH CABLE - 2 SETS 20 REPS.

2 SETS ROPE CRUNCHES ON KNEES, 20-30 REPS, SEE COACH FOR PROPER FORM

[Juan C Ayllon]

-6-

LOWER ABS:

LEG RAISES: GO TO CHIN BAR, HANG FROM STRAPS. DO 2 SETS 12 REPS EACH OF KNEE UPS OR STIFF LEGGED LEG RAISES FOR THOSE LOWER ABS. GET RID OF THAT LOWER BELLY DOUBLE BUBBLE FLAB WITH THIS EXERCISE. or
LAY ON BACK. PULL KNEES INTO CHEST, LIKE I SHOW YOU IN CLASS, OR DO PILATI EXERCISES, BUT MOVE THOSE KNEES, DRAWING THEM UP TO MID-SECTION.


AEROBICS:

30-45 MINUTES PER DAY: TREAD MILL, JOGGING, ROPE JUMPING OR MACHINE OF YOUR CHOICE IN THE GYM. WALK IN THE BEAUTIFUL PARKS UP HERE IN DUTCHESS, UPHILL IF POSSIBLE, TAKE A PET, BUT GET OUTSIDE.


VITAMINS & SUPPLEMENTS:

BEST VITAMIN SUPPLEMENTS, OR SHOULD I SAY ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY IF TAKING SUPPLEMENTS AT ALL:

VITAMIN C, ESTER C-STAYS IN TISSUE LONGER. 500MG.

VITAMIN E-400 I.U. BUT MUST SAY "MIXED TOCEPHEROLS WITH GAMMA!!!!

B-COMPLEX, AT LEAST 50 MG.

MALES-CHEALTED ZINC 30-50MG.
CALCIUM, MAGNESIUM, VITAMIN D COMBO.

THINK POSITIVE, NO NEGATIVE THOUGHTS. PICTURE THE WAY YOU WANT TO LOOK AND MAKE IT HAPPEN. GET BUSY AND DO IT! ONE DAY AT A TIME.

IF YOU ARE DEPRESSED, WORK OUT! IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE A KILLER WORKOUT, BUT WORK OUT. TRICK YOURSELF INTO THE GYM, PROMISE YOURSELF YOU WELL DO 10 MINUTES, AND THAT WELL GET YOU INTO THE GYM. THEN THE 10 MINUTES WILL TURN INTO 30!

IF YOU EAT BAD FOOD, WORK IT OFF BY WALKING, AEROBICS AND ABDOMINAL WORK.

RECENT STUDIES ON CNN, SHOW THAT 6.5-7.5 HOURS OF SLEEP IS THE MOST BENEFICIAL AND HEALTHY. MORE IS NOT BETTER AND LESS IS JUST AS BAD.

BEST OF LUCK.

RON & BRETT LIPTON

[Ronald Lipton]

To those of you who want to see the specifics of the Affidavit, it is on page 4 of this thread.

Thank You,

Ron

[Roberto Aqui]

I must of missed the beer refreshment exercises. That's OK, I'll just grab another and go through the regimen again.

Congrats to Ron on a fine regimen. Maybe he could become a personal trainer for some of the NY media and sports stars.

[Ronald Lipton]

After that workout it is definitely Miller time Robert.
First one's on me.

[jyoungfan2]

Joey Archer will not be at the hall of fame induction ceremony.

[Ronald Lipton]

I figured that, as no one has seen anything about Joey for many years, something is terribly wrong here as in Mrs. Bates in the fruit cellar wrong, I hope to God I'm wrong but either Joey is so sick they will not let anyone see him, which is wrong, or God knows what.

Not one iota of information comes from the brother. Very scary, very strange.

I would love to do a story on Joey and hope someone can find out where he is and get the truth about this great fighter.

[Rafael]

Hi Ron,

You have probably commented on this in the past, but given your knowledge on these fighters, I could not resist asking you about it. I was just reading the current issue of Ring magazine, and they had a flashback to 1962, where their fight of the year was Hank vs. Giardello. Did you witness that fight? What are your memories or recollections of it?

Thanks pal,

Rafael

[Ronald Lipton]

Hi buddy, how are you doing?

Wow, what a memory and what a fight. I remember it was real cold outside the arena and people were talking about it afterward as the greatest war they had seen at the time. I felt Hank won the fight but don't tell Joey on me, one Judge had it a draw I believe and the other two by a point or so.

I saw shots that would kill an ox land on Giardello and he told me in person in Philly when I testified for him in his lawsuit V the Movie Hurricane a couple of years ago that Hank was absolutely the hardest puncher he ever faced and he faced Tiger, Fullmer, Carter and Durando among other bangers.

Joey as usual would tie him up, turn him, jab feint, jab again, sneak a right to the head, sneak a left hook to the belly, but Hank was none stop in beating a steady wild swinging bunch of leather on Joey raising welts on his body and sending the water and sweat and blood flying with shots, while he growled as he threw them.

They were just helacious punches and if you saw Tiger V Hank, it was those kind of shots, and I thought he really hurt Joey, who never admits he was ever hurt, but never goes down or even staggers. Hank was a wildman in the fight and kept coming forward to destroy and keep punching.

He was the winner over Joey in his hometown of Detroit about 6 months earlier and Joey wanted to get it back.

It was held in the same place as when Joey fought Carter, in the Convention Center in Philly. I always made it a point to watch Hank fight as he was one of my favorites and I got to talk to him a few times and liked him very much. I also saw him fight Johnny Person and several others in person

He was one cool guy to me and he really reminded me of a sharp classy Ray Robinson kind of confidence. He was so strong and durable when he was lighter at middleweight (he fought welter too) I hated to see him put on weight and tarnish his image.

He had a good sense of humor and would talk to the fans after the fight. His real name was Joe Harrison and he worked in the Detroit Zoo on the side. He later became a Muslim and was known as Jusuf Salaam.

Rocky Alkazoff knew him too, and I bet has some great stories about Hank. I hope Rock shares a few with us here.

Best to you buddy,

Ron

[Ronald Lipton]

Sorry I misspelled PERSOL

[Ronald Lipton]

It is very hard for a fan like me that lived through and enjoyed the great matchups on the Gillete Calvalcade of Sports, and the tough matchmaking which was the signature of Teddy Brenner in the old MSG, to see how some of these guys in my wildest dreams get a fight on tv and into your living room.

To see on the last live show from Arkansas a fighter like that heavyweight Manley, with his breasts flopping in a fight that would not be acceptable in the Golden Gloves in NJ or NY is really the state of boxing today.

I believe for ANYONE to get onto tv ANYTIME in a fight they have to be good enough to be there and look the part of a fighter. If not DON'T put them on at all on national television.

I really feel that the fighters listed in the top 100 in the new Ring magazine, and the fighters in the top 10 in the world are
not well seasoned or could stand up to the fighters in the 60's when you really had to pay your dues to get a shot on tv.

Oh well, I am getting old I guess.

[Kid Achilles]

Ron,

I saw Manly fight, perhaps in the same scuffle you were talking about. What's really sad to me is that he actually defeated his much better conditioned opponent.

The heavyweights are just awful and it's at the point where it's nigh unbearable. I just hope Peter-Klitschko is a real barnburner while it lasts.

[Ronald Lipton]

I just looked at the Ring Ratings and tried to be really honest with myself as to what fighters in all the pages even interested me a little bit.

The only names I came up with which would even interest me a little bit were: Samuel Peter, Joe Calzaghe, Jeff Lacy, Jermain Taylor, Hopkins, Winky, Judah, Hatton, Mayweather, Corrales, Castillo, Juan Diaz, Barrera, and Morales.

Are there many other good fighters? Yes.

Do I always watch the ESPN fights, yes. But even the above names are so limited as to really exciting matchups that pique the interest of the average Joe, you see what I am saying here.

Tyson or Ali could fight anyone and people would come to see it. It is getting to be a big yawn and that for me is very sad.

[StingerKarl]

I agree one hundred percent with Ron here.
There are some good kids out there; but none to set the world on fire.
I think this has a lot to do with the trainers out there as well.
There are some fairly competent guys as far as getting a fighter into condition goes; but none I would classify as a Great Trainer and Teacher in the Futch, Blackburn, Goldman, or Arcel mode.
None come even close.
The talent pool at the training level has dried up for the most part as far as developing a Great Fighter goes.
Karl

[gregbeyer]

don't expect too much...i have not seen a thing in little klit that would lead me to believe he can escape the 1st round against such a thunderous puncher as peter... amazed that this fight was taken by the klit camp.
greg

[Ronald Lipton]

There are still good sharp fighters out there but not many to me. Nothing to make me excited like a division full of talent and great matchups. I think to myself sometime that right now Boxing is in one of the most pitiful states it has been in years.

When you lose a guy like me and the zone fans' interest, they had better start finding some exciting talent to save the game but quick. The general public needs a Joe Louis, Dempsey, Tyson, Carlos Ortiz, Canzoneri,
Gavilan, Bob Foster, Moore etc but quick, or goodbye big fights.

When I saw that guy Carlos Maussa win a "World title" e.g., when I look at the whole pathetic heavyweight division, the real lack of excitement in the light heavy division full of retreads, nothing exciting in Super middle, the middleweight with only Taylor v Hopkins for any interest, Jr Middleweights-sooo boring,
Jr. Welter- a few good matches for Hatton, Lightweights-some good matches there too, Jr lightweights-same guys over and over, with not one big exciting name, in the whole lot, not one big dynamic puncher except Samuel Peter, who is a fat guy with heavy hands or is going to get fatter and fatter like Tua did.

Man I am telling you pick up a Ring Magazine and look at the ratings I don't get that thump in my mind like I did when I picked up a boxing magazine to read an old Boxing Illustrated with really great champs and great contenders stocked to the limit in each division.

Punchers and boxers galore.

Just absolutely terrible today. Still love boxing, always will, just telling you the truth. The worst EVER

[gregbeyer]

i remember jerry quarry talking about learning to fight one day. he said some guys taught him the basics and other guys helped get him in shape but that it was not until teddy bentham came along and taught him the tricks of the trade that he felt he was really learning something. those guys are all gone it would appear. teaching those tricks a lost art.

it has been slowly slipping away for sometime now. when i saw those clowns in mike tysons corner applying a water balloon to the swelling caused by buster douglas i knew we had turned a corner. these days we have main event fighters that have no idea what to do when they are hurt, guys not trained in how to fight backing up and fighters brought up way too quickly on the merits of punching power alone ala kermit cintron.

i remember jackie mccoy saying once that anytime eddie futch spoke, he listened. that is a skill in its self and one lacking in many of todays know it all trainers who toss a towel over their shoulders and hope their charge makes them look like a genius. that ain't training. i really don't know where it all goes from here. in other sports the techniques have become more scientific over the years. boxing seems to have gone backwards. when these young guys hear us talking this way they often think we are just over estimating the past but i really do remember the old trainers from L.A. gyms passing on the trade secrets to their charges and then seeing them improve with every effort. i don't know what is going on now but have seen very little improvement lately. IMO.
greg

[kikibalt]

Ron, Karl and Greg
Karl the key word in your post is " teacher's " we
just don't have any, yes there are a few but i can count
them on one hand , this new so call trainer's did't
spent years in the gyms learning the trade.
It's like Greg say they toss a towel over their shoulder
an now they are trainers, yes Ron it is sad , that why i stay away from the gyms now

Frank B.

[Ronald Lipton]

thank you.

All you guys really know.

I have a tape Frank, where Carlos Ortiz calls into a live tv show where I am doing an interview and talks about when we were boxing together training for his title fights later in his career. Teddy Bentham was with us alone in this spartan training camp which used to be Madam Bey's and later became Ehasan's in Chatam NJ.

I trained with him day after day with just him leaning in over the ropes while Carlos and I punched each other bloody and swelling, day after day, round after round he taught me good.
Every trick there is

I can pass this stuff on but this referee blackballing shit has really got me down until Mike DeLisa can turn it around for me.
I also was trained day after day by Jimmy Wilde up in the same place when Carter had Jimmy taking care of all of us, and of course I was with Angelo Dundee who also called into that show for me the same night as Carlos did.

No one is like them except the guys they taught and we are getting old, worn out, and sad from the lack of respect in boxing for us anymore.

If I told a strong kid how to train and live clean all the time, they never listen, the boxing experts they have for commentators, trainers know nothing compared to others.

Look what Frank did with two of his own sons, one of which decked world champions. why isn't he on ESPN or me, to hear our opinion, it's a joke.

Even the kid who was kicked out of here was calling Paul Pender a piece of garbage and calling me filthy names and he was less than 20 yrs old, there is no real understanding or appreciation of great fighters, except it seems on the Zone here, where everyone from the original Davey Moore to Gilroy, McAvoy and Turpin is remembered the way they were.

[wildhawke11]

You know something guys i am from the other side of the world in UK but i agree 100 with what your saying. On the hand i suppose it could be because give or take 10 years we are all around the same age.

Also i to have to admit i cant even name you our present champions and top contenders in most of the divisions. I at one time loved the fight game but nowadays i find it so hard to keep interested. Somehow the excitement and magic that once existed for me sad to say seems to have gone.

Is it because there are so many other ways to make a living these days for the average man. Is it because the more talented young men turn to other sports. It also does not help when you see a welterweight in the ring with a guy who has obviously in realty a Middleweight.

One of the problems is i think is in out time fans could follow a fighter who maybe would lose one in every three fights but he did his best, gave it everything he had and gave us value for are hard earned cash. These days it seems the fighter has to have a winning record to keep any fans interested. The drawback of course is he never learns from these easy and carefully picked fights.

Some of the old time greats had losses on there records but because they went in with all styles each fight was a learning experience for them and they came out far better and experienced fighters for it. Even with our present knowledge of correct diets and modern physical training methods. If the right teachers are not around anymore all we can turn out is well trained robot zombies who cant even think for themselves when in the ring.

On a last not take a guy like Charley Burley who most modern fans have probably never heard of who never got the chance to win a world title and who even Archie Moore admitted gave him a boxing lesson. Can you imagine just how many titles in this day and age Burley would have held. These sort of men are long gone now and craftsmen like him are now just a thing of the past.

Boxing and the fight game has changed and never will be the same in my humble opinion sad to say.
Cheers Gentlemen
Danny

[Ronald Lipton]

Well said Danny.

Charley Burley would eat em alive today.

[kikibalt]

I go back over 55 years of watching an been in the game of boxing, an i'm not liveing in the past.
But fighter nowday are not what they used to be when i was a young man , it's been years since i seen a fighter block a jab an counter over the block jab you just don't see that anymore , it all go back to the lack of good teaching

Frank B.