Anyone See Ali's Dozen on Classic Spots ?

**HE Grant** · 07-29-2008, 08:26 PM

For the first time I saw reverse angle footage of the murderous Shaver's second round right hand. You see Earnie tee off facing the camera and Ali has his back to us ... no doubt it was a hell of a shot but now I can say I believe without question that it was not close to the shot Shavers dropped Holmes with in the seventh round of the rematch. In the Ali fight, Shavers is slightly down low and is punching up. The right hand lands close to the end of full extension and does not land full on the button. Ali had already begun to move away from it. Regardless, Ali was pretty stunned but tricked Shavers. The Holmes shot was about as flush as one can land and dead on...

Just though I'd share that with you guys .... FYI

**10-8** · 07-29-2008, 09:52 PM

Larry's feet were planted and he was throwing an uppercut while Ali was moving away and able to pull back taking some of the steam from the shot.

However, is it not very probable that Shavers, not known for his stamina, had less speed and snap on the shot he caught Larry with? Shavers was already showing signs of weariness and sloppiness. Comparing it to the shot that hit Ali, it looks slower on delivery.

The shot that Holmes was hit with likely had greater impact due to what Larry was doing at the time he got tagged. I don't think the shot on it's own was necessarily harder. The right hand he threw at Ali may have been harder due to Shavers being fresher.

**PD99** · 07-29-2008, 10:40 PM

HE - good to see you back on board. Couldn't respond to your pm - mail box full.

When Shavers caught Holmes I think Holmes' head was moving toward Shavers also, even if only slightly. Can't check Youtube, precariously close to my download quota for the month. Funny, though generally not appearing too fast, Earnie could whip home some reasonably fast bombs on occasion imo.

**PeteLeo** · 07-30-2008, 12:08 AM

YouTube was a download quota? When did this happen? PeteLeo.

**PD99** · 07-30-2008, 12:28 AM

Pete - didn't mean to confuse. I meant my my agreed download quota with my ISP - NOT YouTube.

**HE Grant** · 07-30-2008, 06:30 AM

Thanks PD ...

I did think about the second round power vs the second round and it is worth consideration but based on the positions, the arc connection point and the momentum of the fighters I have to say Larry got hit about as hard as I have ever seen a guy get him with one shot ... it's not to say Larry Holmes had a better chin than Ali but he definately had a great one ... another issue overlooked regarding Holmes chin is the Norton fight. Ken was an extremely good puncher, really very little doubt there .. what that fight again. There are half a dozen times when Ken lands his Sunday best flush and Larry takes them.

Not that anyone was disputing it but Holmes had a great chin. Either way, it was very interesting to see footage you have only watched for thirty years from another angle.