Ufc 97

[diggity]

Looks to be a decent card with some contestants from last seasons TUF.

What's the take on the main events? Liddell-Rua & Silva-Leites

I think Liddell is due for a good win. I don't think he is as shot as people or his losses say. Rua wasn't so hot in his last performance either. One may say he is the one who seems to be on a more rapid decline. Either way, it will be a good fight.

Hard to ever pick against Silva but Leites is very tough & solid on the ground. Maybe with a little more seasoning he could be one to upset Silva when he isn't at his best but I don't see it happening especially on the wake of Silva's last lackluster performance.

[Dogman_Tony]

Leites is, as you say, a live dog, but a dog for sure. I don't know about Liddell. A couple of years ago I interviewed him for Playboy, but I wanted to interview Quinton Jackson because I expected him to beat Liddell. This model of Shogun isn't much, but Liddell has lost four out of five, and if Shogu connects....bye bye. Liddell has been working to tighten up his boxing with Howard Davis, though. We'll see. I'm interested in the two WEC fighters at LH coming over to fight on the main card, Brain Stann and Steve Cantwell who respectively are fighting TUF fighter Krystoff Soszynski and Luis Cane. I have a feeling both are going to go down hard, especially Cantwell to Cane, but they should be explosive fights. Also hope they show the return of the Crow, David Loiseau v Portland's own Ed Hermann. Losieau is a bad dude.

[doomeddisciple]

I'd like to see Liddel try and keep his hands up and pump a jab out to set up woth rather than lead left hooks to the body (that got him KTFO in the Rampage fight) or lead right uppercuts with his left hand down as he did against a laterally moving Evans.

I would be monumentally shocked to see Silva loose.

He should just move up to Light Heavy and dominate them too!

[Dogman_Tony]

Well, that's why they brought in Davis, I guess. We'll see.

So you think Sylva could handle Evans and Machida? I'm not so sure. I'd like to see Sylva fight some more grapplers at 185 or 205 before annointing him pound-for-pound best. An out of shape Travis Lutter wasn't a real test, abd Dan Henderson won the first round from him before losing his cool. I'm not saying he couldn't do it--just saying I'd like to see it. Sylva's aura of invincibility comes from his two wins over Franklin, but he's had only seven fights at middleweight in the UFC and 1 at LH vs James Irvin. I'd like to see him take on Luis Cane at LH just for giggles. Be a better test than Irvin. That said, if Evans beats Machida, you may get your wish.

[diggity]

Silva-Machida would be great. I don't think I could pick Silva over Machida with any confidence. Evans maybe but I will never make the mistake of writing him off again until he gets old & slow. I would love to see any combination of the 3 fighters take place.

[Dogman_Tony]

Doubt we'll ever see Machida-Sylva. As much as I dig the Brazillians, they piss me off, their so clubbish. I just read a thing where Machida says Sylva would destroy Fedor. Fedor's too strong. Eventually he'll lose, but not to a guy who can cut to 185.

[diggity]

I agree, Fedor would sooner lose to Lesnar than Silva.

[Dogman_Tony]

I don't think Lesnar will be UFC champ that much longer. I have a feeling he'll take Mir, but maybe not, and even if he does there are guys coming who I think will be a problem.

Fedor's just too strong for Sylva. Sylva may hit him, but he won't take him out with one shot, whereas when Fedor hits Sylva, it'll put him down, and if it gets to GnP. who's better than fedor?

[diggity]

I don't think Lesnar will be UFC champ that much longer. I have a feeling he'll take Mir, but maybe not, and even if he does there are guys coming who I think will be a problem.

Fedor's just too strong for Sylva. Sylva may hit him, but he won't take him out with one shot, whereas when Fedor hits Sylva, it'll put him down, and if it gets to GnP. who's better than fedor?

Likely not. I'm not so sure he takes a focused Mir either.

Fedor is just too strong, tough, durable etc. for Silva.

[diggity]

Call me crazy but I still think Liddell may wind up the a win since this is a real crossroads for him. I have to imagine he is taking his mistakes & adjustments in the gym as gospel. Whether or not they become natural at this stage in his career is another thing but I think an off Shogun may be the best chance out there to redeem himself somewhat for recent times. I mean Liddell is probably never going to beat Evans or Jackson, so it's not like he has a clear path ahead at least in the public's mind. Plus White's been real public about his thoughts on Liddells future based on his perfomance here. He has a lot riding.

[Dogman_Tony]

Nah, I can believe it's a win for chuck. Good thing, he's not engaged anymore. That was making him less mean. I can actually see him beating Jackson, but not Evans, and surely not Machda. But Jackson fucks up too. I mean. Wanderlei KOed him viciously twice. It's just knowing the guy, I hate to see him getting beat so I tend to take the pessimistic view so I don't get let down.

Well, I would like to see Mir win, but most MMA guys I've talked to say they think Lesnar's has improved too much for Mir. Hope not.

[diggity]

I hear ya.
I don't want to see him get beat either but losing like that in your late 30s after a long career isn't quite like getting mowed down in your 20s. Plus I think the evolution of MMA has a play in Liddell's difficulties if he were really to stay around & compete with guys like Evans or Machida. Guys like Chuck reigning & remaining consistently successful are going to be fewer & far between as time moves on the way it looks.

I don't care who wins between Mir & Lesnar. I just hope its good & resolute.

[Dogman_Tony]

Chuck turns 40 in December. Urk.

I kinda want Mir to win. I hate to think Lesnar's such a mutant, he beats skill....

[doomeddisciple]

Well, that's why they brought in Davis, I guess. We'll see.

So you think Sylva could handle Evans and Machida? I'm not so sure. I'd like to see Sylva fight some more grapplers at 185 or 205 before annointing him pound-for-pound best. An out of shape Travis Lutter wasn't a real test, abd Dan Henderson won the first round from him before losing his cool. I'm not saying he couldn't do it--just saying I'd like to see it. Sylva's aura of invincibility comes from his two wins over Franklin, but he's had only seven fights at middleweight in the UFC and 1 at LH vs James Irvin. I'd like to see him take on Luis Cane at LH just for giggles. Be a better test than Irvin. That said, if Evans beats Machida, you may get your wish.

I more view it as there isn't a lot of unfinished business at 185 or that many meaningful fights, whereas Silva in the mix at 205 just adds further spice.

[Dogman_Tony]

No, there's not, tho I think another Marquardt bout might be interesting, and then there's GSP at 185, a fight that wouldn't happen if Sylva moved up. Assuming GSP gets past Alves, I'd expect this fight to happen.

I wonder what would be the point of Sylva fighting LH if Machda is champ, since both men have said they won't fight one another. If Rashad beats Machida, different story.

Anderson Sylva just opened a Black House gym in LA, the idea being to improve his English and become more media friendly, and the UFC is apparently behind this, so they obviously have plans for him one way or another. I'm thinking they really hope to build a GSP fight into a mega-event.

[Dogman_Tony]

Boy, that had to be the worst title fight ever. I think Anderson Sylva drops in pound for pound consideration. I kept thinking of Fedor-Noguera during the fight--when Noguera pulled that dead bug pose on Fedor, the man just jumped into his guard and beat the crap out of him. Sylva was safety firstwith a guy he should have taken out.

Liddell-Rua went as I thought. I was very impressed with Shogun, though it's clear Liddell has lost a lot. Shogun was fluid, creatively aggressive, and finished the show. He just might be able to return to form, and if he can, at 205 he's gonna be a handful.

Sosynski did a nice number on Stan and Luis Cane didn;t live up to expectations, but still pulled out a W.

I just can't get excited by Kongo. I hope they feed him to Velasquez or Carwin and don't waste Lesnar's time with him...

[diggity]

I agree with all of the above.
Very disappointing performance by both guys. Silva played it mega safe & Leites seemed content to survive, never taking any chances to make matters worse. I can never understand when challengers do this. Fights like this are the highlight of their careers & to put forth such a non-effort is sad. I figured once 3 rounds were in the bag for Silva that Leites would show something but it never happened.

I was hoping Liddell would be able to pull a rabbit out of the hat but the truth is told on paper in this one. Fighting isn't a sport friendly to happy endings. The better guy with a potential for a good future won which is best for the sport. Chuck is done & this needed to happen to close the door.

I'm tired of Kongo also. He seems content to do the same things over & over again. Needless to say he won't go far. He was lucky to face that version of Crocop a few years ago. I'm still not over the disappointment of that fight & that ugly loss to Gonzaga. I was really looking forward to Crocop in the UFC.

Well at least Krystoff looked good.

Looks like Vinny still can't pull out a good performance yet eh?

[Dogman_Tony]

Vinnie's a puzzle--I can't figure him out. I mean, Eliot Marshall? Come on!

I actually blame Sylva more than Lietes. I recall guys flopping in front of Sakuraba and Vochynchkin and so one, and they just found creative ways to finish the fight. Sylva is even more athletic than they were, and he does what? Punch a guy's feet, dance around like a fool. And then that sulky interview afterwards, with the translator whitewashing what he said...the guy's become a prima donna.

Yeah, Chuck...see ya, man. But I'm excited for Shogun. Let him fight a Jardine next, then rematch with Jackson, and if he can get past those guys, title shot...

Kyrstofff looked very good. I'm eager to see him matched up with a better guy....

[diggity]

Yeah it was definitely a weak effort for someone who was so "bothered" by his last performance. You're right, he has become a primadonna.

Krystoff really shows his power when on the ground. It seemed like he could have twisted Stann any which way he wanted.

[Off The River]

I only had the chance to see the Lidell-Rua fight. Chuck's defense was the same as ever- not there! I can't understand why he doesn't keep his guard tighter. His guard is way too wide and he was far too wild. His left hook was very amaturish.

The one thing that is evolving most in UFC is the Boxing skill, Rua showed a tight defense and that way the difference in the fight. Chuck has great takedown defense, but he really should have learned to throw shorter straigher punches a long time ago.

[doomeddisciple]

Liddell needs to retire, but if he wants to keep figjhting, he needs to walk around for the next 3 months with his right hand nailed to his cheekbone.

Silva - Wow - THAT was disapointing.

I reckon Dana would have been a bit red eared at that card, not one of the UFC's I will be coming back too review the tapes for in future I don't think.

[Dogman_Tony]

Chuck is retired. Dana retired him and has a personal services contract that'll keep him involved in the sport...and now Chuck can take advantage off all those movie offers...

Silva has just turned into an ass clown. He's a great fighter, but his last two bouts have shown that he's a flawed guy--he doesn't like it on the ground--and he's acting like it's everybody else's fault.

Dana said he was personally embarrassed by the main event and was head back to the dressing rooms to inquire of Sylvia what the fuck and whither.

Yeah, Off the River, Chuck's a dinosaur, but it was spirited fight at least, miles better than the main event.

Now for Rashad-Machida. That one will be really interesting, especially in light of the Sylva bout, because they will feel pressure to be aggressive.

[doomeddisciple]

Well I have no desire to see Chuck fight again. He was a beast, but I don't really want to see his head bouncing off the canvas anymore and I guess Dana doesn't either.

I'd like to see Silva fight like Houston Alexander at 205 and see what sort of shape the division is in before having a run at whoever holds the title.

I'd like to see Silva Vs Silva (Wanderlei)!

[Dogman_Tony]

I think you're gonna see Sylva v Sylva, but I don't see that as much of a fight, because Vanderlei is as shot a fighter as Chuck and may be the only MMA fighter who throws wider punches. I suppose you know about he feud between the Sylvas and now that the Ax Murderer is at 185, it's inevitable if he doesn't get KOed by someone else.

I'd like to see Anderson Sylva versus Forrest Griffin--a guy who has a chin and can test him on the ground.

Is Alexander still in the UFC? If so, he must hanging on by a thread.

[Off The River]

Agreed. Wanderlei is done. Both guys were great to watch, but their time has come and gone.

[doomeddisciple]

I agree that Wanderlei is over as well - Where I'm coming from is that he's a name at 205 and he will press a fight out of Anderson as long as it lasts. For the 185 champ, its the sort of fight he needs to build back some momentum.

Alexander is still listed.

[Dogman_Tony]

Off The River, Wanderlei was the most violent fighter I ever saw--he was great in Pride, but now...

The trouble is, Doomed Disciple, is Wanderlei is not fighting at 205 any longer; he's dropped down to middleweight, a fact that has annoyed AS no end, and fighters, when they cut, especially after years and years at one weight, often have trouble adpapting to the cut, so this--added to the fact that Wanderlei is shot--will taint the result in the fan's eyes. Anderson has called Wanderlei's move "pretentious"-- talk about the pot calling the kettle black--and if the GSP-AS fight gets made, and AS wins that, I'd expect to see his early next year.

Frankly, if AS is going to move up, I want him to fight a gatekeeper, someone who can challenge him. Houston Alexander would be interesting because he has the power to make AS think about going to the ground, but he doesn't appear to have a chin. The UFC only has Anderson for three more fights, and I wonder if they're going to be in a position to resign him. The guy wants to fight Roy Jones, which be a mistake for him, even given how depleted Jones is, and maybe his performances lately are a kind of protest. The one thing I don't want to see is more of what I saw Saturday, so after GSP (if he beats Alves), I hope he moves up, fights a gatekeeper, and then takes a shot at the the LH title Of course if Machida has the belt, AS won't fight him, because he's a friend. I don't know...

[Dogman_Tony]

Ooops. The UFC only has Sylva for two more fights.

[diggity]

I really hope he boxes RJJ. It would be a huge mistake for Silva even now.

[Dogman_Tony]

I really hope he boxes RJJ. It would be a huge mistake for Silva even now.

Totally. It's a joke, but he seems obsessed with a has-been boxer. Weird. Because even though this weekend's fight was a joke, you could still see how great an athlete Sylva is. But a boxer...un-uh.